Crude Prices Drop, Gas Hovers »

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  Avg rating: (+11/-1 10)

  STONERS

  Jan. 21, 2007, 12:14 a.m.

  Gas retailers' prices aren't just dependent on crude. They said their prices are also influenced by the price of ethanol, which they have to mix in at 10 percent a gallon. Currently the price of ethanol exceeds the price of crude.

  16 Replies

  • 
    Avg rating: (+2/-0 2)

    Matteu00

    Jan. 21, 2007, 3:03 p.m.

    over 3,000 mergers didn't hurt either. The competition is reduced to a small number of golf buddies. Also, if you look at the refiners I believe there are now 10 producing around 90% of our nations total gas supply.

    It is shame that the FERC has been a lapdog of industry under this president. It was established during WWII with the primary purpose of promoting National Security by diverisifying the number of refiners and suppliers, and second to prevent price gouging in times of war and emergency.

    Thanks George. One or two refiners get hit and our nation is crippled.

    11 Replies

    • 
      Avg rating: (+0/-0 0)

      capecoralM

      Jan. 21, 2007, 4:18 p.m.

      PLEASE! Ignorance is not a virtue. Gasoline is a commodity traded on the commodity exchanges around the world. Oil companies do not "SET" the price of gasoline. The market does. George Bush does not get to "SET" the price of gasoline.

      Gasoline is the largest single volume refined product sold in the United States and accounts for almost half of national oil consumption. It is a highly diverse market, with hundreds of wholesale distributors and thousands of retail outlets, making it subject to intense competition and price volatility.

      Please Educate yourself

      http://www.nymex.com/RB_pre_agree.aspx

      http://www.wtrg.com/daily/gasolineprice.html

      10 Replies

      • 
        Avg rating: (+6/-1 5)

        capecoralM

        Jan. 21, 2007, 4:30 p.m.

        Wholesale gasoline traded in the $1.54 range. In addition to that price the government be it Fed, state, or local tacks on additional Taxes. However, in general, if gasoline is selling at about $3 a gallon, major companies make a profit of about 10 cents a gallon. 300/10 = 3% profit.

        Government take 229/55 = 41.6% profit. Who is gouging you?

        7 Replies

        • 
          Avg rating: (+0/-0 0)

          yeahright

          Jan. 21, 2007, 6:24 p.m.

          Thanks for the calculation. Would you also be so kind as to calculate the number of gallons Exxon/Mobil must sell to make those mutlibillion dollar record profits quarter after quarter (excluding the U.S. election quarter, of course)@3% profit??? Blindness is not a virtue either.

          6 Replies

          • 
            Avg rating: (+1/-0 1)

            capecoralM

            Jan. 21, 2007, 8:07 p.m.

            Perhaps rather than disputing the figures I have presented you will offer your own figures rather than just words. By the way who owns Exxon/Mobil? Perhaps you might be able to gain the information you seek by reading the shareholders annual report.There you will find that besides auto fuel exxon/mobil has many other sources of income. You will also find that the US is not it's only market. And due to the value of the Euro VS Dollar the US company once converted to the US dollar benefits from duing business outside of the US. You will also find that the effective income tax rate is over 40%.

            http://library.corporate-ir.net/library/11/115/115

            Do you dispute that oil & gas are commondities traded on the open market? Do you dispute that crude is also a commodity that has it's price set by the market? You are correct Blindness is not a virtue.

            5 Replies

            • 
              Avg rating: (+2/-1 1)

              capecoralM

              Jan. 21, 2007, 8:11 p.m.

              Q. Who hiked the price of gas?

              A. Market speculation.

              The report I posted is from Exxon/Mobil's shareholder information and is for 3Q 2006.

              3 Replies

              • 
                Avg rating: (+1/-3 -2)

                capecoralM

                Jan. 21, 2007, 8:18 p.m.

                3Q SEC filing.

                http://ir.exxonmobil.com/phoenix.zhtml?c=115024&p=

                2 Replies

                • 
                  Avg rating: (+0/-0 0)

                  Dave59

                  Jan. 21, 2007, 9:34 p.m.

                  I find your quoting of these reports to be redundant. The simple fact is that at every turn in the last couple of years we have seen prices jump at any hint of the increase in the per barrel price of oil, we have not seen a similar decrease when the per barrel price falls. If i read my market correctly the the futures on this should probably decrease as well. As with all futures if the price is falling then sell is usually the word of the day. Thus causing lower prices. I have not seen this happen.

                  In my considered opinion this indicates one of two things, either investors suddenly reversed their ideas or there is some sort of price fixing going on.

                  Since I don't like to loose money in the market I think betting on futures where the base price of the product is falling is not a good deal. I would have to guess and say there is some artifical support of the price here.

                  But then I am used to hearing Bovine Fecal matter come out of people like you.

                  1 Reply

                  • 
                    Avg rating: (+0/-0 0)

                    capecoralM

                    Jan. 21, 2007, 10:34 p.m.

                    That would be a simple way of viewing the situation. However one must factor in the dollar value. I am simply presenting the documents wether you view them as bs or not they are simply the best documents for expalining the situation. When some say "BUSH" sets the price of gas it flies in the face of reality. And yes there may very well be support from speculation who are in deep for say $75. In stating that you then agree that the market is setting the price and not "BUSH". One other factor to mention is the new laws that were introduced requiring a 10% ethonal blend. IF you have not noticed the price of ethonal per gallon is 1.52% higher than regular unleaded. This to has caused the price of gas to go higher. http://zfacts.com/p/60.html.

                    "But then I am used to hearing Bovine Fecal matter come out of people like you." Who am I like? I might be a corn farmer for all you know and am loving life in the subsidized energy industry. Get real joker.
            • 
              Avg rating: (+7/-1 6)

              protoham

              Jan. 21, 2007, 10:49 p.m.

              You have to remember, these people just want to blame someone other than themselves. We have become a nation of cry-babies. No wonder the rest of the world looks upon us with such distain.
      • 
        Avg rating: (+15/-3 12)

        Lurch

        Jan. 21, 2007, 8:39 p.m.

        Good lord you need a lesson on how free markets work. Take an economics course.

        1,000 of retail outlets? No kidding, all owned by a handful of capitalists interested in squeezing every penny out of the consumer while enhancing their oligopoly positions.

        In a free market above normal profits are competed away by newcomers attracted by those above normal profits. The oil companies have been making record over record over record profits for what, three years now. PLEASE!

        1 Reply

        • 
          Avg rating: (+0/-0 0)

          capecoralM

          Jan. 21, 2007, 10:47 p.m.

          When crude prices rise, all the gas stations raise their prices accordingly -- they have no choice. They all pay (more or less) the same prices for refined gas, and make a relatively small mark up on the fuel they sell. As wholesale prices rise, they pass along the increase.

          When the price of Crude eases, however, what forces gasoline prices back down is simply competition. One station lowers prices a few cents, and pulls in more traffic; That forces others to do the same -- until prices gradually work their way back down to the earlier prices (assuming crude returns to its prior price).

          You may be surprised to learn that gas stations make the bulk of their profits on the quickee mart / convenience store, or on automobile repairs -- and not on fuel. They are greatly incentivized to keep the prices low enough to draw you in as a customer, where they can make their profits on, well everything else beyond petroleum. I do agree though that the corporate stations are a factor
  • 
    Avg rating: (+7/-2 5)

    Lurch

    Jan. 21, 2007, 8:42 p.m.

    So a drop in 90% of material costs doesn`t translate into lower prices because the price of 10% of the material costs have not changed.

    What`s wrong with this picture? Also to note is that the moment the 90% of material costs go up, prices at the pumps go up immediately despite no rise in the other 10%.

    1 Reply

    • 
      Avg rating: (+0/-0 0)

      saladman

      Jan. 21, 2007, 9:10 p.m.

      Although I do agree with you about the oligopoly comment, capecoralM is correct when he says that market speculation is driving up the price. If people think that the price of foreign oil will increase in the future, they will buy more gas now and increase the demand for gas. This increase in demand will increase the price.
  • 
    Avg rating: (+0/-0 0)

    whitelIlighter

    Jan. 21, 2007, 9:40 p.m.

    That may be true but if you ever noticed that when the price goes up on a barrell of crude we see the price overnight. Also for the price of crude today we should not see a change for about 3 months....so how do you explain that.

    1 Reply

    • 
      Avg rating: (+9/-1 8)

      capecoralM

      Jan. 21, 2007, 10:49 p.m.

      Retail sales. A good article that explains the mechanics.

      http://bigpicture.typepad.com/comments/2004/08/gas
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  Avg rating: (+2/-0 2)

  STONERS

  Jan. 21, 2007, 12:15 a.m.

  Another factor driving prices up is the fact that they no longer get an excise tax exemption for selling ethanol mixed gas.
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  Avg rating: (+9/-0 9)

  mivan4

  Jan. 21, 2007, 3:33 p.m.

  Alternative fuels are a threat to the oil cartels, this is not the first time oil went down to ward off alternative threats.

  We need to continue the development of alternatives for the

  good of the country in the long run, regardless of oil prices in the short run that may discourage alternative developments.
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  Avg rating: (+11/-2 9)

  uncle-dave

  Jan. 21, 2007, 1:42 a.m.

  Ethanol is just one part of the equation, this country needs to sponsor a real alternative energy program. We sent a man to the moon, and for better or worse we ushered in the atomic age. We have the brain power and the resources, all we need is the will.

  2 Replies

  • 
    Avg rating: (+14/-1 13)

    STONERS

    Jan. 21, 2007, 1:43 a.m.

    Exactly!!!
  • 
    Avg rating: (+0/-0 0)

    Lurch

    Jan. 21, 2007, 8:44 p.m.

    We had that federal program in the 70`s, then Reagan sunk it to appease one set of his masters.

    Just one of Reagan`s mistakes that made life more difficult and dangerous for the average American.
• 
  Avg rating: (+3/-7 -4)

  miklkit

  Jan. 21, 2007, 11:43 a.m.

  Exactly!
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  Avg rating: (+0/-0 0)

  Lurch

  Jan. 21, 2007, 8:46 p.m.

  Don`t forget that our elected representatives have shown that they will not only turn a blind eye while the eye companies gauge us, they will give the oil companies huge tax breaks.
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  Avg rating: (+0/-0 0)

  mbkijb

  Jan. 21, 2007, 1:48 p.m.

  Surely, one must consider PRICE GOUGING....Uncle Meat, you are right on the money, and that is a funny name!!! lol

  2 Replies

  • 
    Avg rating: (+4/-0 4)

    yeahright

    Jan. 21, 2007, 6:35 p.m.

    UncleMeat and mbkijb got it. Let's see if I read this story right ... prices at the pump don't come down immediately with the fall of crude because the oil in the "pipeline" was purchased at the higher price, ok, makes sense. So, when the price at the pump goes up the DAY the price of crude goes up ... the "pipeline" was empty and they are using the oil purchased that day???? WOW, talk about supersonic transport. Beam it over Abdul.

    Why is it no one seems to be willing to call the oil execs when they give us a b u l l s h i t answer that has absolutely no bearing what-so-ever on the problem. Instead of a free carwash with a fillup we should be getting a tube of KY!! Wake up America, you're getting you know what without so much as a kiss.

    1 Reply

    • 
      Avg rating: (+2/-0 2)

      mbkijb

      Jan. 21, 2007, 7:33 p.m.

      lol- I just had to laugh at that one....You sure said it like it is.....

      Wake up america is right.....I can't believe how people just sit and accept things.....but we do. I don't understand why we as a nation do not stand up to this- If we all carpooled or even rode our bikes (if possible) for one or two days, imagine what that would do to BIG oil.
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  Avg rating: (+5/-0 5)

  evelyna

  Jan. 21, 2007, 1:50 p.m.

  I have to drive for a living. If I get 30 cents from my employer and 30 cents from the gov. That is not covering 1/3 the price.

  How about if I just park and no one makes money.

  3 Replies

  • 
    Avg rating: (+0/-0 0)

    STONERS

    Jan. 21, 2007, 2:01 p.m.

    I know a few that also drove for a living and found other jobs because it didnt cover it,sorry...
  • 
    Avg rating: (+3/-0 3)

    Edmar15

    Jan. 21, 2007, 4:16 p.m.

    If you get 30 cents from your employer, you can't get 30 cents from the government. Either/ or, but not both. Plus, you are getting 30 cents per mile, not per gallon of gas. It more than pays for your gas unless you are driving a military Hummer. Assuming your car gets 25 miles per gallon, that equates into $7.50 per gallon. the price of 30 cents per mile was set to cover both gas and wear and tear on your vehicle.
  • 
    Avg rating: (+9/-2 7)

    capecoralM

    Jan. 21, 2007, 10:54 p.m.

    30 cents a mile and 30 cents a mile is 60 cents a mile. How many miles to the gallon do you get. According to your statement you are getting 1 mile to the gallon?
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  Avg rating: (+0/-0 0)

  foggy

  Jan. 21, 2007, 2:41 p.m.

  What are you people worrying about gasoline prices? What about fuel oil prices? Normally fuel oil is 30-40 cents or more cheaper than gasoline, yet fuel oil is 20-30 cents more expensive than gasoline. That's the real scam and there is no ethanol excuse here.

  1 Reply

  • 
    Avg rating: (+0/-2 -2)

    mbkijb

    Jan. 21, 2007, 7:38 p.m.

    Yes, indeed, the heating oil industry jumped on the inflation train real quick, didn't they? So did the electricity and kerosene companies (though kerosene is not as bad as the others that I am aware of).... I smell a dead rat here. Must have gotten stuck under the wheels of that train!!! Here a rat, there a rat, everywhere a rat rat.
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  Avg rating: (+5/-1 4)

  THOMNH62

  Jan. 21, 2007, 3:18 p.m.

  lets take a quick look at whats going on here, with the 08 election really around the corner and the america attention span as short os Bubba's weenie, you can but that depending on who is the front runner, a rep, the prices will fall to 120 a gallon if it is a dem they will stay at just under 200 a gl. Big oil remember.

  1 Reply

  • 
    Avg rating: (+2/-6 -4)

    mivan4

    Jan. 21, 2007, 3:36 p.m.

    So, What you are saying if a Democrat wins gas prices will go up!!!!!!!!!!!1
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  Avg rating: (+0/-1 -1)

  tonykntcky

  Jan. 21, 2007, 3:44 p.m.

  What about diesel... It's usually cheaper than gasoline (by product of gasoline) so much higher.
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  Avg rating: (+1/-0 1)

  paoconnell

  Jan. 21, 2007, 3:59 p.m.

  I agree that the oil companies aren't reducing prices as quickly as the per barrel price drops.

  Note that the article is from a Hawaiian newspaper. Also note in the article that Hawaii gets its fuel from Indonesia. Those are two factors that raise the price of gasoline there--everything in Hawaii is more expensive than it is in the 48 states, just because of the transportation costs.

  Locally (New Mexico) the price of regular gasoline is at or below $2 a gallon in larger cities. Gas prices vary among states; often gas is cheaper in the East and Midwest than it is here.
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  Avg rating: (+0/-1 -1)

  Openeyes

  Jan. 21, 2007, 4:05 p.m.

  Lets see if I have this right.Bush is handed the presidency and the price of fuel creeps up over the years.Remember he has a history in the oil patch.Failed at it but he knows a lot of people at the top there.So now that the price has droped a little from historic highs and all the oil companies have posted record profits this is just business as usual.So if a dem gets elected the price of gas goes up?The reasons given for the current price are just as bogus as any they've ever given.

  1 Reply

  • 
    Avg rating: (+8/-2 6)

    protoham

    Jan. 21, 2007, 10:59 p.m.

    So Don't buy it!! There are a million way to save gas.
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  Avg rating: (+0/-0 0)

  B737Tech

  Jan. 21, 2007, 4:44 p.m.

  If the price of crude goes up the gas prices rise immediately even for the gas has already been refined & is in storage. On the other hand, if the crudes prices drop it takes weeks for the gas prices to follow suit. Does that sound reasonable to anyone???
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  Avg rating: (+0/-0 0)

  Flashygrrl

  Jan. 21, 2007, 5:02 p.m.

  Well, I don't know about the rest of y'all, but we're breathing a bit of a sigh of relief here in Michigan. Gas is on average $1.90 right now....it never got THAT low last winter.
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  Avg rating: (+0/-0 0)

  confusedude48

  Jan. 21, 2007, 5:29 p.m.

  didnt know gas was still up....its been under 2 bucks here for almost a month or two cents above.

  1 Reply

  • 
    Avg rating: (+7/-1 6)

    capecoralM

    Jan. 21, 2007, 11:03 p.m.

    $2.29 here in Florida. Volume is up but so is consumption. China and India showing the most % growth. And yes the Oil companies have had spells where they lost money or broke even. In addition as we all may know oil goes into making everything. Plastics, transportation, lub's, etc...It is not just gasoline anymore.
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  Avg rating: (+5/-0 5)

  MeanMotherUSA

  Jan. 21, 2007, 5:30 p.m.

  1-21-07

  CORPORATE $ GREED RUN$ WILD.i.e. California It's Still $2.49.$2.63 Gallon And By Spring Back Up $3.00 Gallon- Cheap Gas Corn Fed Mix With House Hold Cleaners Kick Up Octane...

  MeanMotherUSA
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  Avg rating: (+0/-2 -2)

  TheAttacks

  Jan. 21, 2007, 6:05 p.m.

  Taxes? Greed?
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  Avg rating: (+0/-2 -2)

  Lourdestortoise

  Jan. 21, 2007, 6:51 p.m.

  WE CAN'T BE SLAVES TO THE OIL COMPANIES ANY LONGER!!!

  Bike, walk, take the freaking bus.

  Maybe this wouldn't be such a big deal if we weren't so oil dependent!

  1 Reply

  • 
    Avg rating: (+8/-1 7)

    yeahright

    Jan. 22, 2007, 4:06 p.m.

    Exactly right!! Lourdes, if you'd like, you can ride me. (Oh shoot, did I say that out loud ... I apologize)
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  Avg rating: (+8/-1 7)

  boogins

  Jan. 21, 2007, 7:37 p.m.

  gas is $1.97 here in Dallas.
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  Avg rating: (+0/-0 0)

  methoan

  Jan. 21, 2007, 9:51 p.m.

  I would just like to say that while I totally despise all gas companies and would willingly sacrifice my life to kill any and all of those who run and support them, gas prices here in Lexington, Ky are as low as $1.83. Its as much the local retailers as it is the big guys (we have lots of local competition. What we need is alternative energy source that doesn't suck. C'mon oil giants, you have the money, you have the resources and you and I both know oil isn't going to do us good much longer. Create something renewable and you can have my money...without a renewable resource within ~100 years (being generous), not only is our environment degradation going to be irreversible, but our economy will collapse due to a lack of affordable energy options. Anyone want to save our economy and make a few billion? Hydrogen ain't it (so far), ethanol sure won't work and we're about to be past peak oil and arguing about doesn't do ******. So how about it. Give a solution, not an argument.
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  Avg rating: (+3/-3 0)

  AJaye

  Jan. 21, 2007, 10:39 p.m.

  Because they are allowed too...Oil Barons run this country...Hell the run the world...BOO BUSH
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  Avg rating: (+2/-0 2)

  NeoWiccan

  Jan. 21, 2007, 10:51 p.m.

  Thank god for my bike, it may be slower than a car but it gets me where I want to go and guess what, it's FREE.

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