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Beyond Padilla Terror Case, Huge Legal Issues »
Posted by: ETproductions 2 years, 6 months agoJose Padilla is known worldwide as the man who plotted with Al Qaeda to detonate a "dirty bomb" in a major US city. But there are serious questions as to the truth of this allegation. Many legal scholars and intelligence experts say Padilla's ordeal highlights the danger of a government that obtains information through secret, coercive m
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ETproductions
I'm a pretty eclectic guy. I own a small business that develops web sites and builds Yahoo! Stores. I'm fiscally conservative, socially liberal ...
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Comments: 71
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ETproductions
Aug. 14, 2007, 7:23 p.m.Who poses the most serious threat to life and liberty? Look back at the recent past. Pol Pot snuffed out 2 million of his own people. Hitler and Mussolini were responsible for killing over 10 million. Joseph Stalin killed around 20 million within the Soviet Union. Chairman Mao is the all time king at 50 to 100 million.
If you take all of history and total up the deaths produced by all terrorist over all time over all the Earth, they don't come close to Pol Pot, who is a real piker on the murderous government list. Clearly, totalitarian governments are FAR more dangerous than terrorist.
I'm certainly not saying we should just ignore terrorist. But we'd better be careful how much of our Constitution we dismantle in our fear of them.
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mcgrievysr
Aug. 14, 2007, 9:46 p.m.Great submission, ET. It's alarming to think that a U.S. citizen can be detained and interrogated in such a way. As more and more becomes known about this administration's lack of adherence to the Constitution, more distrust becomes inevitable. When habeas corpus was suspended, many claimed that this sort of thing could not happen to an American citizen. It has. There are many skeletons in the closet of this White House, and we can only hope that more see the light of day. This administration's goal? Absolute power. The citizens be damned.
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jordan11
Aug. 14, 2007, 9:51 p.m.Any American who advocates it's OK to strip the rights of ONE of us because of their pitiful fear for themselves, is anti American by ALL measure.
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berkeley
Aug. 14, 2007, 9:55 p.m.remember that john ashcroft got on television while he was in moscow to annouce the arrest of this man. it was all for show, and it destroyed jose padilla's life.
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Obaku
Aug. 14, 2007, 10:35 p.m.And never forget that Padilla is an American citizen, regardless of what he has, or has not, done.
What we tolerate in his treatment sets a precedent, that can then be applied to any American citizen.
Even you.
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jovial
Aug. 14, 2007, 10:56 p.m.Fear and arrogance. Ignorance plays an important part in this as well. They are slowly and deliberately dismantling our democracy. Democracy will be redefined for the coming generations. Surveillance, being held without trial. Prosecution for anti-government propaganda. Vote tampering, corporate fascism, and lobbyist's controlling government. Jails filled to capacity, roundup and deportation of all illegal immigrants. No unions, unbridled militarism in world affairs. We will be an isolationist society. People will be kept ignorant about other cultures. History books will be rewritten. Just as now they try to push Reagan as this "great President". The internet will come under attack. It's only a matter of time. It's been tried already. A lot of these things already came to pass. There are people that would like to do much, much, more than this. We must not let these things befall our great country.
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tchef
Aug. 14, 2007, 11:26 p.m.I remember worrying about this kind of thing happening on 9/11. I was afraid that we'd start invading other countries, removing our rights. Fear and panic are great motivators.
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Radiofreeeuropa
Aug. 15, 2007, 1:09 a.m.If you told me 20 years ago that habeas corpus would be suspended and the executive branch would amass powers not legitimately given constitutionally, and 20 some percent of the country would support this... I'd have laughed in your face. Not possible. We aren't that stupid.
Apparently we are.
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lfergie812
Aug. 15, 2007, 4:24 a.m."In February 2004, then White House Counsel Alberto Gonzales told a meeting of the American Bar Association that citizens who take up arms against America don't deserve legal counsel."
By that statement, anyone that would hold a police officer hostage with a gun would fall under that category whether he harmed him or not. What Gonzales is basically saying is that anyone that commits a crime with a weapon does not deserve a lawyer. That is really scary coming from a high government official.
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getreal1
Aug. 15, 2007, 9:23 a.m.ET Many people fall prey to a lot of fears in life. If you look into the history of the 1900's you will find that because of a certain race, creed many a person is told what to think and believe. Al Qaeda uses race to recruit. They tell Africans that they are muslin. If that is so then why were their women running around bare breasted in the wilds of Africa in centuries past? Padilla may have been the prey of Al Qaeda. To know Padilla one must track his ancestry and his childhood. Being in a one room cell is a torture for the mind. Bodily torture is a different thing. One will say anything to stop it as in many cases through history. To be a citizen of one country and to conspire and bring trouble against it, is treason. He should have a lawyer. I know that if I were a lawyer I would not want to represent him for the simple fact that he seems to be educated, as I see Al Qaeda as nothing more than an inmature gang of adults in a prehistoric religious frame of mind.
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evelyna
Aug. 15, 2007, 12:42 p.m.Everyone worries about medical malpractice lawsuits. The reason our taxes are so high is because the politicans are always engaged in one kine of legal battle or another.
Even the state and county.
Should we have to pay for all of this? Most of us cannot afford a lawyer and the government has it rigged so they can always win the case because they can keep things going indefinately on your dime.
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joeblowe
Aug. 15, 2007, 1:49 p.m.This entire thing is bizarre from start to finish. I don't really see any explanation given for WHY this guy was at an al Quida training camp in the first place. Unless he is undercover for the C.I.A. or something - right there he is a traitor REGARDLESS of whether or not he actually built or detonated any bombs. Since al Quida was a declared enemy of the United States, joining them, or helping them in any way fits the Constitutional definition of "traitor." No other charge is necessary. As a U.S. citizen, on U.S. soil, he WAS entitled to a fair and speedy trail. It was entirely WRONG to have held him without rights. Even a traitor has the right to a fair and speedy trial before he is hung. This business of NOT putting on a defense is puzzling though... maybe he doesn't HAVE a defense? Eventually I expect Jose to end up in prison - possibly sharing a cell with the people who were responsible for so grievously violating our Constitution.
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agentX
Aug. 15, 2007, 2:49 p.m."Terror war innovation: long detention
The dirty-bomb allegation emerged from information obtained through a Bush administration innovation in the war on terror. That innovation called for the open-ended detention of terror suspects to facilitate aggressive, prolonged interrogations. The questioning was often accompanied by specially authorized harsh interrogation techniques, including isolation, sensory deprivation, and stress positions, among others, according to former interrogators."
Great, so we're getting garbage intelliegence from people we are torturing on the basis of some smoking-bomb excuse?
ETproductions, do we really want to win the "war on Terror"?
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markmawn2
Aug. 15, 2007, 3:02 p.m.Padilla also loosely matched a police sketch of one of the two suspects leaving the scene of the OKC bombing. Coincidence? Was he a hired gun?
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markmawn2
Aug. 15, 2007, 3:13 p.m.Link to the pictures in the article:
http://www.glennbeck.com/news/06132002.shtml
I hated seeing all the news saying they saw a Middle Eastern looking man leaving the scene. OKC is full of mid-easterners, asians, mexicans, etc, and the white folk there distrust anyone who is not white (like red-necks with truckloads of explosives can be trusted). Jose Padilla. Does that sound M.E. to you?
I remember the Gov crawling into his bunker and making statement about the Palestinians in OKC who were responsible. See the pattern? Brown equals BAD.
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Sandmn
Aug. 15, 2007, 4:11 p.m.As I understand the situation, padilla has almost nothing to defend. He has quite literally, committed no crime. He will not be tried for any acts of terrorism, or even plotting to commit such an act. His trials is reduced to simple sympathy charges. He was sympathetic to alqaida. That in itself is going to tough to prove. The government simply has no case without the torture confessions and they can't produce them. This entire padilla show, was a headline deal. Look at what Bush has prevented. See how torture pays off. Give me a break. The only terrorists plotting anything against this country, is Bush and Israel. Wake up for crying out loud. Take a look at the men Bush has put in charge of things, like Chertoff. Do you know he holds a dual citizenship with the US and Israel? Or how about a few other guys like:Wolkfowitz, Perle,feit... Sclomo Bron,Scooter Libby, Bolton,Woolsey. He has packed the house with Israelis and nobody seems to care. We're screwed
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Sandmn
Aug. 15, 2007, 4:15 p.m.If americans don't open their eyes soon, and do something about this blatant government takeover by israel, we're all in for a world of misery. Now Netanyahu is taking over as head likud, which is no surprise since Sharon is vegged. But benny boy is equally as evil as sharon ever was. Padilla is a scapegoat, sacrificed to appease the american appetite for vengeance. Nothing more.
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Sandmn
Aug. 15, 2007, 7:43 p.m.The government has no proof of anything. They produced a photo of him with a spotted rag on his head. They supplied a document form afghanistan from 2001 that the cia found, and had his "fingerprint" on the first page, period. No al quaida training camp films, no al quaida applications, no tribal photos of him and his al quaida buddies, nothing. If they find him guilty, it will be a complete and total undeniable miscarriage. The only witness against padilla is some guy named Yahya Goba. This is the only guy saying that padilla attended any camp. BS!
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djrevelky
Aug. 16, 2007, 3:46 p.m.This just in, Padilla was found guilty. From the AP:
"The key piece of physical evidence was a five-page form Padilla supposedly filled out in July 2000 to attend an al-Qaida training camp in Afghanistan, which would link the other two defendants as well to Osama bin Laden's terrorist organization.
The form, recovered by the CIA in 2001 in Afghanistan, contains seven of Padilla's fingerprints and several other personal identifiers, such as his birthdate and his ability to speak Spanish, English and Arabic."
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