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Posted by: jovial 1 year, 6 months ago
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jovial1 year, 6 months ago
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Neophile1 year, 6 months ago
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Here's the full interview translated from Spanish:
http://64.233.179.104/translate_c?hl=en&sl=es&t...
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santa01 year, 6 months ago
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i can't get the story for some reason... but based off the title, it sounds a little extreme. FDR took us from hoovervilles to defeating the german industrial war machine and into the middle class boom of the 50's. good leadership, good policies, and little luck and we'll be back on top. maybe that's blind patriotism, but i believe it.
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rightfromwrong1 year, 6 months ago
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U must be on drugs jovial....America will never be on top again.The Bilderbergs are on top. The Jewish zog control everything. Bush,Clintons,Kissenger and many others are all part of the scheme. There can be little doubt they had the Kennedies killed as they were against secret societies.
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hyperbola1 year, 6 months ago
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Automated translations are still deficient. If you can read the interview in spanish.
http://www.elmundo.es/elmundo/2008/06/14/intern...
By the way, El Mundo is the largest of the "right-wing" newspapers in Spain.
Can you imagine a "right-wing" newspaper in the US (say the Wall Street Journal) publishing this kind of interview? Might give you an idea of the degree of self-censorship in the american corporate media.
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cowboygrandpa1 year, 6 months ago
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hyperbola:
When you don't insert the hateful rhetoric you come across very well.
Thanks.
You are quite right. The self censorship in America is tied to corporate interests.
Our nation reminds me of the old Rome more and more daily. Corrupted and crumbling from the abusive political power wielded by those looking to build personal fortune at the cost of our nation.
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TheRealizer1 year, 6 months ago
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Washington D C is a giant revolving door, people go from legislative and White House jobs to lobbying firms then to jobs in the military supply business. The military procurement folks go from there to the boards of the firms they bought from. It reeks of corruption on a GRAND scale!!
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sinophil491 year, 6 months ago
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jovial - You are right. Gore Vidal is way off the mark.
Our national debt incurred from WWII (1940-1945) was 2.1 trillion dollars. Our government finally paid it off by about 1980 under Pres Carter - a period of 35 yrs.
By the time GWB leaves office, the debt will be about 10 trillion dollars. This 4 times the WWII debt.
So assuming approximately the same average economic growth of the last 35 yrs, the debt will take 4 times the time period to pay off = 35X4 = 140 yrs.
However, considering the devalued dollar, the sky high oil prices, the cost of fighting global warming, the time frame will probably be considerably longer.
Add to that the further cost of the Iraq war. Even if Obama starts the process of withdrawal the day he takes office, the process will still take an additional trillion dollars. My guess is that it will take 150 to 200 yrs to pay off GWB's national debt. Who's to say I'm wrong?
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CHAM1 year, 6 months ago
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Sino
And lets not forget the "Accrued" ( Long Term Liabilities ) that has shot up during the Bush Administration.
When Bush took office, this type debt stood at $20 Trillion.
By September 1, 2007 it had risen to $53 Trillion-per the Comptroller General of the USA and in his annual report. The next report is due this Sept.
I'll bet that debt will exceed $60 Trillion. How long will it take to pay that back down to $20 Trillion?
Sixty Trillion is 60,000 Billion.
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sinophil491 year, 6 months ago
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CHAM - Sheesh. Economics has always been one of my weak points. To my everlasting regret, I never took Econ 101 in college, because I thought it would have been boring. All my superficial knowledge is from reading and trying to understand terms and issues on my own.
Now here comes another term I don't understand and I have to cram this into my shrinking brain.
Lord help me!!
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rightfromwrong1 year, 6 months ago
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slate1 year, 6 months ago
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Let's say a billion years if we are going to pull a number out our azz to try and further vilify Bush.
raping & pillaging you say?
So every country in Europe, Asia, as well as most of Africa are raping and pillaging, since they are ahem BUYING the one resource that and otherwise remorseless region of the planet?
Buying, each country, with money, not stolen or raped or pillaged as you claim with little more fact than you just think that's what's happening.
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tanglang1 year, 6 months ago
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dissent1 year, 6 months ago
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Goppy1 year, 6 months ago
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LOL!!!
Thanks tangy! You REALLY expressed our Right Wing POV that tiem.
You are right ... on so many levels.
When we got somebody in charge, such as GW, to who we have given over our complete trust and adulation, EVERYTHING - is what it is!
And we are happy to turn a complete blind eye to whatever transpires. And you are one of the best at that.
But let a presdient who represents a political point of view which we RESENT ... which we consider evil (even though we dont know why) ... well ... we work to undermine that.
Remember, we are Christian Conservatives. What that means is that our Conservatism is a Religion ... And our Christianity is our Politics.
AND
Rational Comparin and Contrastin are against our Moral Code.
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slate1 year, 6 months ago
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Fools like you dissent gleefully believe every bad prediction you hear, it bolsters your claim that Republicans are evil and democrats are saints. Me thinks you need to consider that there have been TWO parties at work since the 1800s and both parties have guided us to where we are today,,, not one good and virtuous party (usually the one you vote for) and one bad/evil one, your opponent. They are Both good and both bad, and in the end they have the same goals (government power). If this is not true, then why are we still kicking around the same broken things for more than 50 years now? Because one party is really really trying and the other is holding them back? Surely even you aren't that naïve?
Anyone that actually buys into the argument that Democrats are for the country and Republicans are not OR vise Versa, those are the true fools involved in this political discourse.
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dissent1 year, 6 months ago
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"No we don't but your foolish zeal of making these wild eyed claims is worthy of us making fun of you."
i'm not gore vidal but for the sake of your hallucination i'll play along. so tell me, what exactly is it that you don't think is fine?
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slate1 year, 6 months ago
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I've said it enough times that things aren't fine, so I won't be playing that silly game. The point is you guys pull these numbers out and throw them on the wall and dance around your hate Bush bonfire,,,,, so then I come in and make fun of your false pretense of knowing how long it will take to 'cure' the world of Bush,,,,,
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slate1 year, 6 months ago
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So if these numbers are off the wall, what is your forecast?
How the heck do I know? That really depends on many things doesn't it?
20? 40? the world could end tomorrow for all we know,,,,, A brilliant mind could come up with the soultion for a low cost energy source which could be made here,,,,,
Many things can happen 'tomorrow' it's foolish to make guesses of what will happen,,,,,, you'll most likely be wrong
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slate1 year, 6 months ago
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One party is more a slave to corporations?
I suppose you haven't noticed that many in the Democrat party have belonged to corporations, or have accepted money from them, as well as lining their pockets with military funds?
I supposed you've also missed the point that the Dems are Slaves to their own 'special' interests?
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slate1 year, 6 months ago
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LOL yeah buddy your party is da bomb,,,,, the party of the people right
That's why Obama put his elisist foot in his big mouth?
The party against racism? Cough, both camps of your party has acted like the KK the last few months
FOr the country? That's why china has some key secrets thanks to your former golden child?
Yeah words mean things,,, but something the meanings change,,, I'm sure you can think of a few?
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nonparted1 year, 6 months ago
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"One party is more a slave to corporate interests (as opposed to populist interests) than the other. If you fail to recognize that, you've got the kool ade in your veins."
kazak people that has ur state of mind need to get a grip on reality by making this statement above..
both political parties are slaves to corporate interestst as u say.
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slate1 year, 6 months ago
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you see, that's the difference between you and me,,,,
LOL yeah your reality is differnt than mine. Do you think it would be the same? Heck your 'reality' is differnt from every person here and around the planet,,,,, your view is your view and mine is mine,,,,, if your 'reality' thinks it will take a 100 years to cure the ills of Bush who am I to challange that personal mindset,,,,,, Lest you could have done was to pcik a number that you may be still around to say you told us so.
In the end Diss, we all know what this and other claims is about,,, Bush is evil,, MCCain is Bush Jr.,, Vote for Obama and Change Halleluiah! You partisan? Nooooooooo!
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dissent1 year, 6 months ago
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"The point is you guys pull these numbers out and throw them on the wall and dance around your hate Bush bonfire,,,,, so then I come in and make fun of your false pretense of knowing how long it will take to 'cure' the world of Bush,,,,,"
metA·phor
n.
1. A figure of speech in which a word or phrase that ordinarily designates one thing is used to designate another, thus making an implicit comparison, as in "a sea of troubles" or "All the world's a stage" Shakespeare.
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/metaphor
100 years = a long time (metaphorically speaking)
.... man, these posts a pingponging all over the place!
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dissent1 year, 6 months ago
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"In the end Diss, we all know what this and other claims is about,,, Bush is evil,, MCCain is Bush Jr.,, Vote for Obama and Change Halleluiah! You partisan? Nooooooooo!"
if these are my reasons to vote for obama i don't see how that makes me partisan. partisan means i would only vote for obama for no other reason than because he's the democrat nominee just as you would be partisan if you were to vote for mccain for no other reason than because he's republican.
i'll add to your point and say that this election is soooo critical that if obama gets to the white house there's hope for at least another generation or two on planet earth. if mccain gets there instead we can all stick our heads between our legs the day after tomorrow and kiss our asses goodbye. that's how important this is
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slate1 year, 6 months ago
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Diss,,,, we are all fairly sure Obama will win, can we agree?
I just hope he can deliver what he's selling and your buying.
I mean come on your are saying that without Saint O there's NO hope for at least another generation or two on planet earth. if mccain gets there instead we can all stick our heads between our legs the day after tomorrow and kiss our asses goodbye. that's how important this is.
Do you read the things you post? Who really thinks the planet on the brink of destruction? Can I see a show of hands?
If Obama wins, the world survives if McCain does it's the end of mankind,, who hear actually buys this thinking?
You know, that's why it's so difficult to talk to you guys, you are more about negative emotion than anything,,,,,
I better vote for Obama I'd not want to be known as part of the reason humans won't survive to the next generation,,,, what life must be like to view it from such a pessimistic point of view.
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dissent1 year, 6 months ago
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don't give me this crap. you have no problem with "negative thinking" when it's spewed by the bush propaganda smoke machine. do i really need to repeat it again and again? it looks like i do....
IMMINENT THREAT!!!
SADDAM'S PACKIN' WMDS AND HE AIMS TO USE 'EM!!!
MUSHROOM CLOUDS!!!
ISLAMOFASCISTS ARE COMING TO KILL AND EAT YOUR BABIES!!!
BOOGA BOOGA BOO BOO BOO!!!!!!
hmmm.... seems awfully "negative" to me. how about you slate? or is you memory now maxed out at highly selective? you and i and everyone in this world knows this admin has run on nothing but "negative thinking". it has had nothing positive to offer and it has left us with nothing but dead bodies and red ink. it was pure bs that started us on this highway to hell and took us into a situation where REAL people are dying, the rest of the world is REALLY turning against us and our economy is now REALLY imploding and now YOU criticize ME for "negative thinking"? give me a break.
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slate1 year, 6 months ago
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LOL you are pretty much out there on this one I'd stop while I could if I were you. At no time in my life (except when Kennedy almost got us vaporized) did I hear any say it's the end of the world if a Dem gets elected and that we won't see another generation.
Mushroom clouds? YEah the Dems actually has a past of using that in TV adds huh?
Imminent threat? You've been keeping up with the foiled attempts of attacking us again no?
Saddam's Packing WMDs? Some very prominent Dems agreed before they disagreed with that.
http://www.cnn.com/ALLPOLITICS/stories/1998/12/...
ISLAMOFASCISTS ARE COMING TO KILL AND EAT YOUR BABIES!!! Neva once have I heard this phrase? However, if I recall ISLAMOFASCISTS did kill 3,000 of us to get this all started. Have you forgotten?
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slate1 year, 6 months ago
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We've said that yes we need to protect this country from someone that may want to attack us and kill as many as possible, but at no time can I recall the IT"S GONNA BE MAN'S DOOM if the other side wins.
The Dems that say the Republicans are Nazis, are going to starve your children, or make the elderly have to eat dog food. They say a Republican vote means one more burning cross in a yard, another man drug behind a truck. Yeah your side is soooooooooo high brow with your positive message.
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hamy1 year, 6 months ago
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I don't think democrats are saints. I do think that Bush did such damage to our nation as to warrant a hyperbole.
And you are the one who is bringing party into this discussion. I never said anything about democrats or republicans. We talked about Bush and Cheney and their war on America.
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tanglang1 year, 6 months ago
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NO they have not. Republicans have gone against President Bush on more than one occasion. I know it's been a whole year since the immigration bill, but you should at least remember it.
And Donald, referring torepublicans as the terrorist party is some panty waste bull sht. Yet we all expected you to say something stupid so we were not surprised.
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tanglang1 year, 6 months ago
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D> None of the above. I work hard, everyday. I work with my hands doing what I love. And in the end it pays off. At the rate I'm going, I'll have my house paid off by the time I'm 35. Not bad for someone the dems say should need help to pay for health insurance.
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mesodude1 year, 6 months ago
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"Let's say a billion years if we are going to pull a number out our azz to try and further vilify Bush."
--And yet you've accepted on blind faith every single estimate Bushco has asked you to swallow over the last 8 years (including predictions of how long our presence in Iraq should be and lowball numbers of people we've slaughtered there). Doesn't sound so ridiculous when the script is reversed, does it, Slater?
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slate1 year, 6 months ago
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Who's protecting Bush? He and congress has damaged things over the last 8 years, I'm not sure if they did it on purpose as many want to claim,,,,, he and Cheney as with any president never do anything alone,,,,,, congress helps,,,,,,, yes even the supposed minority side of both houses are culpable.
But to say the damage will last 100 years is just pulling a good sounding (worse case) number out of the air to help the Democrat party further vilify this administration to gain power and turn our eyes away from the complicity of their own acts over time.
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mesodude1 year, 6 months ago
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lol tangy, I've yet to meet a con on Propeller who says uttered a discouraging word about Bush beyond the usual superficial "yerp, Bush done wrong but..." And that includes you and slater. At most we hear "Bush is not perfect" or "Bush has made mistakes" blah blah blah...That's CRAP. Tens of thousands have DIED because of him and you people think squeaking out an occasional half-hearted remark like "everybody makes mistakes" qualifies as criticism. So prove me wrong, either one of you. Pull out ALL of the posts in which you acknowledge that Bush has screwed up (and I'm not talking about in some nebulous "nobody's perfect" half @ssed way"). If I'm so off target, put your money where you Bush-worshipping mouths are. I DARE you, tangy. ;-P
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tanglang1 year, 6 months ago
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http://politics.propeller.com/story/2008/03/13/...
http://politics.propeller.com/story/2008/03/13/...
http://religion.propeller.com/story/2007/12/16/...
Meso, I spent all of five minutes finding these links. Perhaps you should get you some geritol old man as your memory is slipping. For me to pull out all of the posts I would be on here pasting links for the next five hours. And screw that. There is some cold beer waiting for me up the street.
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tanglang1 year, 6 months ago
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I forgot about this one.
http://politics.propeller.com/story/2008/06/14/...
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mesodude1 year, 6 months ago
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--And in each one of those comments you failed to meet the terms of my challenge, Tangy. In the first, you said basically "I don't agree with Bush on illegal immigration. In the second, Bush isn't even mentioned (although you had plenty of venom towards "the illegals"). In the third you wish that "their family" (the Bush family) would "disappear" (that sent chills up my spine....whooo...lol), and in the last one you give Bush a grade of "F" on immigration. I'd give Hitler an "F" on human rights but that hardly counts as a meaningful criticism. You, I give a D-. Definitely needs improvement. Come back after that beer wears off.
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tanglang1 year, 6 months ago
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"We have enough Gaurd troops to properly secure the border, *we just don't have any leaders* with a pair that will arm them so they can solve the problem."
That covers the President.
The conversation from the third one as that the Bushs, Kennedys and the Clintons all need to be run out of DC. They all need to retire never to be heard from again. That does not meet the terms of your challenge???
I'd swear it was YOU that's been doing the drinkin!
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Candida1 year, 6 months ago
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slate1 year, 6 months ago
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dissent1 year, 6 months ago
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maybe rummy can tells us, you know, 6 days, 6 weeks, i doubt 6 months. maybe dick can tell us, he's pretty sure about EVERYTHING (even if he is always wrong), maybe wolfowitz can tell us how iraqi oil will pay for it, or maybe condi can just make it all vanish in a puff of mushroom cloud. nah, i'm with you on this one, the cc computer has better odds
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dissent1 year, 6 months ago
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"Pssst,,,,, your side is making this 'claim' the balls in your court. Maybe you should consult the Oracle of Delphi, throw some 'bones' or let someone read some entrails?"
Psst.... those are 100 metaphorical years. writers like metaphors. it means, in literary terms, a vewy vewy loooong time. just like 6 days, 6 weeks, i doubt 6 months was supposed to mean a vewy vewy shooort time. only rumsfeld wasn't being metaphorical, and neither were the rest of them. i only wish they had been
btw, this is in response to slate
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slate1 year, 6 months ago
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Hard numbers?
This is all conjecture, anyone that takes the 100 years as fact knows squat.
We recovered from a much worse time during the Depression. Who here is without work and home? Times are tough, but they were tough for me during Carter, Clinton and Reagan too, but I survived. This country will survive this too and sooner than you pessimists think. I have faith in this nation's people over the government.
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mark-stevens1 year, 6 months ago
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tanglang1 year, 6 months ago
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mesodude1 year, 6 months ago
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When we have a draft and begin rationing and when those who cheerlead for the war are actually sacrificing (instead of sitting back with their yaps open waiting for their next tax cut), then we can talk about making comparisons between the illegal invasion of Iraq and those other conflicts. As it is, I imagine many of those who fought for us decades ago are turning over in their graves when they hear comments like yours.
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slate1 year, 6 months ago
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Messo,,,, if you haven't served in Iraq or joined the armed forces, you have little to tell others that they don't have a say if they haven't served,,,,
Quit spinning, ther are newly dead from this war that are already spinning as your side calls them evil occupiers and accuses them of war crimes.
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tanglang1 year, 6 months ago
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While doing meso's homework for him I found posts you had made months ago crying that same BS. My response then is no different than it is today.
God forbid that we allow foreigners who want to risk their lives to serve this nation out of their love for it to become citizens.
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mesodude1 year, 6 months ago
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"God forbid that we allow foreigners who want to risk their lives to serve this nation out of their love for it to become citizens."
--But if American citizens don't think the "war" is worth fighting, maybe there's a lesson in there for us somewhere, Tangy? ;-(
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tanglang1 year, 6 months ago
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mesodude1 year, 6 months ago
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Tangy, what I find offensive is that the only reason you and others on the right are even open to this idea now is that you know Americans don't think the war is worth fighting. If we weren't scraping the bottom of the barrel just to meet recruitment goals, you wouldn't have such a "progressive" philosophy on immigration. You want this war to continue at any cost so you're willing to suspend your hatred for "the illegals" and simply open the floodgates.
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dissent1 year, 6 months ago
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"God forbid that we allow foreigners who want to risk their lives to serve this nation out of their love for it to become citizens."
let me see.... fight our wars and receive amnesty. nah, that's not love, that's a business transaction
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slate1 year, 6 months ago
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BS... This country when the citizens want it, can recover from world wars and a depression in a very short time.
Yeah! A voice of reason in the American spirit.
For those that put their faith in congress to solve our problems. Here's a great example of why you may want to rethink that view.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=e-LOtKIIKcg
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slate1 year, 6 months ago
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AH but this congress has done so much right? Like foring us to use a lightbulb to get us off oil?
You know, a light that will spead heavy metals all over your house if you breal one,,,,,, one that is also only made in China?
I wonder, is there anyone in the US that can make lights?
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mesodude1 year, 6 months ago
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"You know, a light that will spead heavy metals all over your house if you breal one,,,,,, one that is also only made in China?"
--First of all, this is folklore and second, why would your clumsy @ss be breaking light bulbs that don't require changing for years at a time? If you can't install or dispose of a light bulb without breaking it, you're a danger to yourself. Anyway, you suck in plenty of heavy metal throughout the day from all the pollution in the air, a few extra molecules won't hurt you. Just learn to change a light bulb competently.
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donald511 year, 6 months ago
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Slate, we'll never forget the Repug 109th "Do Nothing" Congress that even went to a 4 day week under Hastert! And now how the Repug senators block any real efforts by Congress to make amends for the Repug damage done!
18 of 22 Most Corrupt Congressmen are Repugs in spite of Dumya's guidance to go after only Dems!
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mark-stevens1 year, 6 months ago
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Nothing learned here!!! Someone trying to change the subject... I said if we keep electing a goverment that divides the country. Some people want this country divided, and those may lose a divided country
Obama favors amnesty meaning if illegal and you turn your self in, that you go back to Mexico and apply for immigration.
Obama is not popular with the hispanic voter. McCain by the neo-cons is called Juan McCain.
We have to quit with Obama is evil or McCain is, compared to Bush and Haliburton Cheney, they are both saints
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mesodude1 year, 6 months ago
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"Obama is not popular with the hispanic voter. McCain by the neo-cons is called Juan McCain."
--You're joking, right? Why on earth would ANYONE vote for someone like McCain who has flipflopped on so many issues including immigration reform? Here in the DC area, the Latino and Hispanic communities know which party is for rounding them up gestapo style and deporting them and which party is for humane, rational solutions. Wingers want to hear that McCain is gonna start rounding people up and kicking them out of the US so what's he gonna do?
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SayNO2Obama1 year, 6 months ago
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jovial, he is way off the mark. Wonder if he has been talking to Kucinich? hummm??? I believe HISTORY will show PRESIDENT BUSH to be one of the GREATEST PRESIDENT's EVER. Just wait...PRESIDENT BUSH will go out of office on TOP! GOD IS GOING TO BLESS HIM! Watch and see. THEN all of you can drop me a message...but not until. GET IT?? GOT IT? GOOD!
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miklkit1 year, 6 months ago
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Dumbya does talk to God.
http://pnews.org/ArT/EuR/GoD.shtml
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dissent1 year, 6 months ago
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i have no problem with opposing views but this guy opposes even himself!! he's screaming defiance while running away!! i had to consider it was satire but i think it's just that he's not too bright. i guess that would make him regressive. i can see why he gets your full support
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libsRfunnyComment removed: Hard Banned2 Replies
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splitrch1 year, 6 months ago
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1 to 2 generations at the most. Bush may represent the worst among us but we are 10 times better than that. We will learn from the mistakes of the last 8 years and build a better country than the one bush and his army of kool aid drinkers tried to destroy.
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donald511 year, 6 months ago
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...we instituted the FISA law after the abuses of Nixon... look how Dumya has gotten around it! No, the Repugs just keep refining their evil and should be declared what they really are... a terrorist organization in America, and banned!
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