Comments for Getting Georgia's War On - McCain goes berserk »
Posted By hyperbola 1 year, 4 months ago in NewsThe outbreak of war in Georgia on Friday offers a disturbing and
somewhat surreal taste of what to expect from John McCain should he become our nation's Commander in Chief.
Read Full Story at thenation.com »
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hyperbola1 year, 4 months ago
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....McCain's call to NATO-ize the war is not only frightening, it's also delusional: both NATO and US forces are already stretched beyond the breaking point, even by Joint Chief of Staff chairman Michael Millen's own recent assessment.
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But McCain's brain remains undeterred by reality, a fact that became painfully clear today in Des Moines when he also demanded, "The US should immediately convene an emergency session of the United Nations Security Council to call on Russia to reverse course."
The problem with McCain's bold demand about going to the UN is that Russia already tried doing exactly what McCain called for--and got rejected by McCain's neocon pals in the Bush Administration. Early this morning, Russia convened an emergency session of the UN Security Council, calling on both sides to immediately cease hostilities, return to the negotiating table and renounce the use of force--but the last part about renouncing the use of force is exactly what Georgia's president Mikhail Saakashvili refuses to do.
..... The meaning of this is clear: the United States and Britain are backing Saakashvili's invasion. Why would we back Saakashvili's reckless war, when last year even Bush was denouncing the Pinochet-wannabe's violent attack on his own people during a peaceful opposition protest in Georgia's capital, as well as shutting down the opposition media and exiling of political opponents? That would be a brain-teaser if the last seven years hadn't answered this question so many painful times already.
But with McCain, answering this is a little trickier. When he issued today's Des Moines statement calling for Russia to do what Russia already did a few hours earlier, you have to ask yourself: either McCain's short-term memory is totally shot, encased in an impenetrable tomb of aluminum-zirconium plaque... or worse, McCain simply doesn't give a damn about reality, he just wants to get Georgia's war on, as badly as Saakashvili does. ....-
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DropkickaLib1 year, 4 months ago
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capecoralMComment removed: Retracted by user
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lum-chate1 year, 4 months ago
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4thchance1 year, 4 months ago
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So, what does the great Obamma have to say about all this?
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Oh, never mind, Obamma is on vacation. Obamma has no experience what so ever when it comes to fighting wars. That's EXACTLY why he should not be elected in these days of WARS!-
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dunkirk1 year, 4 months ago
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Obama is on vacation?? yeah I think I remember a President who got a briefing on terrorists planning to attack the US using commercial jets but was too busy going on vacation to do anything. Odd tho too that same president seemed to have set a record by taking more vacation time in the first three years of his FIRST term then any previous President did in their entire time in office. ROFLMAO, just like a 20% to worry about candidate when they sh9oukld be looking tot he Chimp in Charge to lead. Oh wait yeah he's at the Olympics.
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hamy1 year, 4 months ago
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Um...what is wrong with what he wrote?
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Bush DID take more vacation in his first three years of office than any other president took in their entire run and some of those were two term presidents.
http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=George_W._Bush:_The_War_President_is_Mi...br />
Bush IS in China playing grab hiney with the US Olympic volleyball team while war is breaking out in Russia.
http://www.propeller.com/story/2008/08/09/bush-hu-ready-for-another-candid-talk/
He WAS on vacation when he was briefed on terrorist threats at the beginning of his presidency and he DID feel it was unimportant at the time. At least that is what he and his handlers said.
http://dir.salon.com/story/news/wire/2004/04/09/911memo/print.html
And he IS at a 20% approval rating.
So, what was he "re-writing?" What was untrue?
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hyperbola1 year, 4 months ago
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Oh the zioncons in Washington and israel have their boody fingerprints all over this one. Given that they certainly ordered Georgia to attack South Ossetia, the whole incident seems to be a mixture of an "october surprise" for domestic political gain and a continuation of zioncon "oil-games" in the mideast and central Asia.
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Makes one wonder how many people they are willing to kill for political power.
That is why over 70% of American jews are opposed to the ZionCons and why Israelis are increasingly fed up with Zioncons in America victimizing Israel and preventing mideast peace.
Bush's War in Georgia
Washington's bloody fingerprints are all over the invasion of South Ossetia. Georgia President Saakashvili would never launch a massive military attack without explicit orders from his bosses at 1600 Pennsylvania Ave. Saakashvili owes his entire political career to NeoCon power-brokers and US intelligence agencies.
http://www.propeller.com/story/2008/08/11/bushs-war-in-georgia/
War in Georgia: The Israeli connection
The fighting which broke out over the weekend between Russia and Georgia has brought Israel's intensive involvement in the region into the limelight. This includes the sale of advanced weapons to Georgia and the training of the Georgian army's infantry forces.
http://www.propeller.com/story/2008/08/10/war-in-georgia-the-israeli-connection/
A Dirty Adventure — Part 2
Turns out the that Israelis have been supplying the US trained Georgian army with weapons.... Interesting. Israeli arms sales to Georgia are purportedly halted, and the Georgians invade South Ossetia in less than a week....
.... Curiouser and curiouser. The thread that emerges from Bhadrakumar’s analysis, however, is the urgency for the US (and the Israelis) to act quickly to disrupt Russia’s ability to bring natural gas from Turkmenistan to the European market. Otherwise, the US will be forced, to the great dismay of Israel, to broker a deal with Iran so as obtain access to Iranian natural gas to break the Russian monopoly.
Hence, we now see a Georgian invasion of South Ossetia about a week after the Russian announcement of its natural gas agreements with Turkmenistan. The invasion of South Ossetia may well be a strong signal that the US prefers confrontation with the Russians over negotiating a new commercial relationship with the Iranians. In other words, it suggests that the US still sees war as the ultimate solution of its disagreements with them.
The invasion also suggests that the US is incapable of choosing an ally in the region, and persists in the hope that it can economically and militarily dominate both the Russians and the Iranians, and through them, just about every country in Central Asia. Such arrogance is likely to be ruinous for all involved. A dirty adventure, indeed.
http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2008/08/a-dirty-adventure-part-2/
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Searchbeam1 year, 4 months ago
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McCain is so ,much into the Cold War of the past that his vision seems frosted and his brain seems to be frozen in time.
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Very, very risky choice. If we are ignorant enough to elect him, we can be assured of total nuclear annihilation. There will be no second chance!
Come to think of it, we came very close to that during the past eight years. A four-year replay would be Mutually Assured Destruction (M.A.D.).
Logic and reasoning seem to have left his loft!-
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fsev411 year, 4 months ago
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John McCain was raised in a military family and spent his early adult years in the military. This tends to give one the mindset that the military answer is always the best answer. We're the biggest and the baddest and we'll just go kick their butts if they don't agree with us.
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A very dangerous mindset in today's world.-
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Charlson1 year, 4 months ago
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Bullies are more apt to start fights when they have others to do their fighting for them. McCain might have once been a warrior, but he is not anymore - just a pathetic old man who likes playing follow the leader, and now wants to be at the head of the line.
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capecoralMComment removed: Retracted by user9 Replies
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bigurn1 year, 4 months ago
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Again, a free Georgian nation did NOT exist in the Cold War era. They separated from the Soviets when the Soviet Union collapsed.
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We have military agreements with this country, and they are ready to join NATO. Surely you understand the gravity of that.-
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Searchbeam1 year, 4 months ago
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bigurn,
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We have a President and - good or bad - he is the one who is setting the foreign policy and executing it.
John McCain is a candidate for the office of the President. He has not even been nominated by his political party.
At this juncture, McCain has no authority whatsoever to butt into an international crisis. He can only express his opinions about the foreign policy of our nation, and stop right there..
His toothless threats and bellicose statements will only make matters worse for GWB to conduct his foreign policy.
Believe me, it is hard for me to say this! I am no fan of the current President, but we must respect the Constitution, which expressly says that the President, and only the President, has the power and authority to conduct our foreign policy.
John McCain's power as a citizen of this country ends at the borders of our nation and at the water's edge, as does yours and mine.
Of course, McCain has a right to make a fool of himself. And I believe he is doing a great job of doing just that! -
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donald51Comment removed: Hard Banned
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coolslow1 year, 4 months ago
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Hyperbola, are you so blinded by anti-Bushism and enthralled with Obama that you can't see this as a total act of agression by Russia against a country that is miniture compared to Russia? Do you have any idea of the history that Russia has with Georgia and the control that Moscow has exerted over the past 300 years? Do you have any idea of what the Russians are doing in Moldova? Do you know that hte Russians in the past few years have cut off the supply natural gas to Georgia so that the population sat in the cold and dark for several winters? Do you know that the Russians have barred the improtation of Georgian goods into Russia, severely affecting the Georgian economy? This is the latest step in a long running campaign to exert control over Georgia. I think you probabably never heard of Georgia, Ossetia, Abkhazia, and know damn little about Russia. Let;s get Oboma out there and he'll fix it by getting everyone to unify and agree to change. Gimme a break. I am stunned by the tone and ignorance that you demonstrate.
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Endoscopy1 year, 4 months ago
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djn3nunez31 year, 4 months ago
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"There were no UN attempts to get Iraq to adhere to what they had agreed to."
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Of course there were. SCR 1441 for example. Plus the UN sanctions were sucessful in keeping Saddam from developing his WMD programs and rebuilding his conventional army. completely nutralizing Iraq as a threat to it's neighbors and to the world.
"The US acted unilaterally without any reason behind it."
As the Downing street memo proved it was a conspiricy between nations to engage in this illegal and immoral war of aggression.
"The world thought we had no reason to do what we did."
The world knew and knows the reason behind the invasion and occupation of Iraq. Oil. -
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coolslow1 year, 4 months ago
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You know what Dunkirk? Just demonstrate that same sense of ourtrage about the US overthrowing a cruel dictator , with a huge well equipped modern army that had invaded a neighboring country (and everyone believed he had weapons of mass destruction: ask the Kurds) and Russia invading a tiny neighboring country with less than 5% of their population, demanding the overthrow or a democratically elected leader. That's all I ask, just the same sense of outrage, instead of the insipid response from the left. All I see so far is that it is the fault of the US that the Russians are invading Georgia. Oh well, guess we shouldn't say anything about it. The Russians aren't the bad guys. The US failed to understand them. The Russians actions aren't posing a threat to the world, nor or they making the world a more dangerous place. Its the US that is making the world a dangerous place by condemning this action. We just need to talk it out with the Georgians and get them to carve up their country and everything will be OK. Get over it already.
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hyperbola1 year, 4 months ago
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Georgia on Our Mind
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The role of Georgia for the West is to allow it to access Caspian basin energy while bypassing Russia and Iran. Non-economic factors have led the competition to turn violent. First and foremost is the U.S. shredding of international law in its invasion and occupation of Iraq that has opened the door to all sorts of similar pandemonium.
http://www.propeller.com/story/2008/08/12/georgia-on-our-mind/
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MajJohn1 year, 4 months ago
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Nice cut and paste. Is there an original thought buried in there somewhere? First of all McCain "goes berserk". He asked for the UN Security Counsel to meet, exactly what Russia asked for. In McCain's case this is proof that he wants war. In Russia's case it wants peace. WHAT? Because McCain wants the same thing he has short term memory loss. So I guess anytime we agree with an action suggested by someone else we have a short term memory loss. WHAT THE! And get NATO involved! Why we can't do that, already stretched too thin. That's a double WHAT. Is there a suggestion that NATO's involvement would be military only? They can't respond in any other way! WHAT??
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One of the biggest criticisms of Bush was going it alone and alienating our European allies. But if McCain tries it the leftists scream even louder. WHAT THE! Of course Georgia invaded a break away province, Russia did not invade. Why they're only defending their "loyal subjects in the Rhineland" against an ally, . Get my drift folks? Any response the West makes is wrong. And if McCain is involved, he's an old fool. I wonder if Obama took the same stand that he too would be vilified? if not then you can assume this is nothing more that an illogical hit piece.-
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joeeddie1 year, 4 months ago
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Now that Biden, chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee and probably Obama's pick for Secretary of State, has come out with the same message as McCain, watch the stories change. The venerable are needed in situations like this. They also know it's not good to take a political position that can't be defended. This one makes me scratch my head about what some of the liberals on here are claiming to believe.
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hyperbola1 year, 4 months ago
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The problem with your argument is that ZionCons in our own government planned and supported the Georgian attack on South Ossetia, including with money and weapons. They are hoping you are to ignorant to notice that and will again succumb to their totalitarian propaganda about supporting "liberty and democracy".
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coolslow1 year, 4 months ago
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And the reason for this vast right-wing consiracy against a tiny place that you never heard of until five days ago is....? Geez there are so many other better places to take over: Canada; Tahiti, I hear that place is nice; Italy; maybe Austrailia?
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hyperbola1 year, 4 months ago
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Oil and gas. The Israelis have over $1 billion invested in oil supplies via Georgia.
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A Path to Peace in the Caucasus
By Mikhail Gorbachev
... Through all these years, Russia has continued to recognize Georgia's territorial integrity. Clearly, the only way to solve the South Ossetian problem on that basis is through peaceful means. Indeed, in a civilized world, there is no other way.
The Georgian leadership flouted this key principle.
What happened on the night of Aug. 7 is beyond comprehension. The Georgian military attacked the South Ossetian capital of Tskhinvali with multiple rocket launchers designed to devastate large areas. Russia had to respond. To accuse it of aggression against "small, defenseless Georgia" is not just hypocritical but shows a lack of humanity.
Mounting a military assault against innocents was a reckless decision whose tragic consequences, for thousands of people of different nationalities, are now clear. The Georgian leadership could do this only with the perceived support and encouragement of a much more powerful force. Georgian armed forces were trained by hundreds of U.S. instructors, and its sophisticated military equipment was bought in a number of countries. This, coupled with the promise of NATO membership, emboldened Georgian leaders into thinking that they could get away with a "blitzkrieg" in South Ossetia....
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/08/11/AR2008081101372_pf.html-
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BB641 year, 4 months ago
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You're quoting Gorbie?
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Making claims of Georgia being the aggressor is the same line of crap Hitler made when he invaded Poland. The dead peace keepers are very reminiscent too. The force with which Putin hit them with was too well armed, trained and lead to be standard Soviet forces. This was a premeditated invasion force.
On the territorial claims, this area has always been considered Georgian. That was until the Soviets came along. Then, it was flooded with Russians. I understand if Georgia wanted to maintain their territory. The Chechins didn't want Putin running their nation and his "peace keepers" made sure there was peace. By doing what they've accused the Georgians of doing. Funny, one is a peace keeper, the other is a bunch of murderers.-
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hyperbola1 year, 4 months ago
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This "area" that you claim was always Georgian has a population with a different culture and language than Georgians. If you would take the trouble to read what South Ossetians say about Georgia, especially the historical massacres of Ossetians by Georgians, perhaps you would stop spouting zioncon chants and begin to understand why Ossetians do not want to be part of Georgia. Exactly like Kosovars not wanting to be part of Serbia.
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icono11 year, 4 months ago
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Opines on the current situation with Russia, Georgia ad the USA.
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http://www.newsweek.com/id/152087
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/12/world/europe/12diplo.html?_r=2&th&emc=th&oref=slogin&oref=slogin
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/08/11/AR2008081100482.html?nav=rss_email/components
Enjoy.-
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icono11 year, 4 months ago
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http://www.propeller.com/story/2008/08/11/war-in-the-caucasus-towards-a-broader-russia-us-military-confrontation/
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http://www.inteldaily.com/?c=172&a=7888
Try these also.
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bigurn1 year, 4 months ago
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This article is stunning in its wrongheadedness.
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Georgia is a sovereign country. South Ossetia is a province in Georgia; it belongs to them.
Russia is bombing and killing Georgians; it is an act of war.
Georgia was expected to become part of NATO, and the only reason they haven't yet is timing.
South Ossetia trying to cecede from Georgia is an internal problem for them, not for us. We've intervenced politically, and we are Georgia's allies.
McCain has it exactly right. NATO leaders should immediately be called together to formulate a potential response to this. As I'm typing this, Russian tanks are moving on Georgia's capital, Tblisi. They are at war.-
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dissent1 year, 4 months ago
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South Ossetia: Politics, Diplomacy and War
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2008-08-11
"Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies." (Groucho Marx)
The United States and the European Union are very concerned over the conflict between Russia and Georgia, fearing an escalation in the fighting that may affect the entire region.
It might be useful to examine the root cause of the conflict.
During the period of the Soviet Union, citizens of the nations it contained lived throughout its geographical territory. When the USSR collapsed, nationalisms strained the newly sovereign States.
South Ossetia is populated primarily by Russians holding Russian passports.
In 1990, South Ossetia held elections but the Georgians living there boycotted the elections. The Russian majority easily won and declared South Ossetia an autonomous Republic. Then, 98 % chose to unite with Russia, in 1991. Georgian attacks followed and Russian peacekeepers entered South Ossetia, on 14 July, 1992, to protect the lives of the Russian citizens and preserve stability.
South Ossetia’s independence has never been recognised by the U.N., the U.S. or the E.U. So much for the much vaunted ideal of Democracy.
This weekend, Georgian forces attacked South Ossetia and Russian forces naturally responded.
If we lived in a world where Democracy was truly practiced, the “Ossetians” might be able to decide what THEY would like.
http://www.unobserver.com/index.php?pagina=layout5.php&id=5035&blz=1
just on that last point, it looks the "ossetians" already did in their 1991 elections but georgia didn't like it so they attacked. looks like they've done it again-
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dunkirk1 year, 4 months ago
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ROFLMAO, its pretty apparent that the reality of things tends to filter right thru but then again while condemning this as an act of aggression you seem to support Bush and his War of Lies without a question. Repbublicans are a rare breed where logic plays no part in their little world..
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Endoscopy1 year, 4 months ago
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Poor recollection of history. The problem that led to the Texan independence was caused by a cultural problem. This was an expectation of what a government does what it commits to do. The Mexican way was just go along with however it happened without expecting their word was to be kept. The Americans who went there had the belief that once given it should be done. British and German concepts versus Spanish and Mexican concepts
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After time when things were not done that they were promised would be done they became very vocal about those things. Things like the deeds to the land they bought etc. Things grew worse since then the government became adamant about not doing what they said they would do. More words and more anger and the troops were sent in to quell the rebellion. The Mexicans didn't look at the history of the American Revolution and its causes.-
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ConsAreNonGrata1 year, 4 months ago
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Talk about revisionist.
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You're right it was caused by a cultural problem, it was caused by those who emigrated to Texas becoming disillusioned with certain liberties not existing in Mexico that existed in the US.
The problem was THEY AGREED TO THE TERMS before emigrating. They only complained AFTER they settled there.
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tehranchik1 year, 4 months ago
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Endoscopy1 year, 4 months ago
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ROTFLMAO
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Gore tried to have every vote of the armed forces rejected in the 2000 election. This year congress has refused to consider action to prevent it. Previously the Democrats threatened filibuster to prevent it.
Therefore the liberal rule is that the armed forces don't count so neither should their votes.-
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Shadowolf1 year, 4 months ago
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...I remember 2000 VERY WELL...you got your head up your pugs ass; or you are a compulsive liar...he asked for RECOUNT , not REJECT...if you wanna sit there and lie, start your own group; "NeoConArtist Sh!tfumes" as a working title...
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Charlson1 year, 4 months ago
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And boy were they pissed at Hamas and their democratically elected government, which of course they refuse to recognize as legitimate. It boogles my mind when the cons try playing the "democracy card" when in reality they are more akin to dictatorships.
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MajJohn1 year, 4 months ago
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Nice one! But South Ossetians are not Russian citizens. Russia recognizes their passports. Of course in an election boycotted by one side is democratic, as much as our states declaring their independence. So because Georgian forces try to reassert their authority, it's only natural that the Russians respond by killing innocent civilians.
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hyperbola1 year, 4 months ago
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Only one thing you forgot to mention dissent. South Ossetia has NEVER been governed by Georgia. It was actually Stalin who made South Ossetia part of the Georgian administrative district.
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The great bayings from Neo Cons about "preserving the borders" and "attacks on national sovereignity" are actually a call to preserve the borders Stalin established for repressive purposes.
Given that the South Ossetians have never been ruled by Georgians, have a different culture and a different language (Farsi) than Georgians, their case for independence seems MUCH better than that of Kosovo. The South Ossetians are convenient pawns to attack and kill in the ZionCon oil games - all the while braying about liberty and democracy. It is the usual puppet colonial government strategem that Washington likes so much.-
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coolslow1 year, 4 months ago
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Hyperbola is really a good name for you. First, Stalin may have been a Georgian, but he was the leader of the Soviet Union and a Communist. He is not necessarily loved in Georgia for that since he persecued Georgians as vigorously as he did every other ethnic group including Russians. Second, Ossetians don't speak Russian as a native language either, and while thay may have been part of the Soviet Union (when Georgia was a republic of the USSR, one might argue that they were never fully ruled by the Soviets either. Artifical boundries were drawn all over the globe by one foreign power or another. Its got to stop somewhere. The social-economic and political viability of Ossetia as an independent state is hardly credible.
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hyperbola1 year, 4 months ago
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Having suffered mass murders by Georgians previously in history, it is pretty clear why South Ossetians do not want to be part of Georgia. In fact, several other regions of Georgia also object to Georgian rule, for much the same reasons.
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MajJohn1 year, 4 months ago
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Russia had better get used to NATO countries on its border, Georgia is not the only nation. Putin's nose does not need much to be tweaked. What you're missing here is oil, the pipeline to the Caspian Sea. The Russians want control so it can blackmail its former "colonies".
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Georgia501 year, 4 months ago
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Gee, I feel completely like the odd man out here. Let me point out several things.
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1. This is not a partisan issue native to the US.
2. We warned Georgia NOT to tweak Putin's nose.
3. Given Russia's experience with the West since Napoleon, it needs to be understood that there's no way in hell they're going to allow what they perceive to be a contrary (much less hostile) sovereign nation or NATO member on their border.
I'm all for Georgians pushing sovereignty to the max, but there are historical realities and Russian paranoias that will ultimately play a role in where that max is.
My fellow conservatives are going to lamblast me, I realize. Maybe I'm missing something, so feel free to clue me in. But for godsakes don't call me a hyperbola clone....that'd be piling on.-
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hyperbola1 year, 4 months ago
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Why is that shadow? I am on the same side as over 70% of American jews, who also reject the Zioncons. Interestingly enough, more and more Israelis are also rejecting the negative effects that Zioncons in America have for Israel. The zionist lies are crumbling under their own weight.
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Who speaks for American Jews?
A new survey of American-Jewish opinion reveals surprising views on US policy toward the Middle East.
... Sixty-one percent believe Israel is "less secure" than it was before the Bush presidency. Only 26% believe it is more secure. When asked whether the solution to the Israeli-Arab conflict involved negotiating peace agreements or relying on military force alone to achieve security, respondents endorsed the former over the latter by 50% to 34%.
... Joe Lieberman isn't going to like the following results. Only 7% of poll respondents view evangelical Zionist leader John Hagee favourably. Only 19% have a favourable impression of Christians United for Israel, and just one in four said Jewish groups should form alliances with CUFI. Finally, Holy Joe himself only earns a 37% favourable rating (48% unfavourable)....
... Seventy-six percent of those polled believe Israel should negotiate with Hamas on behalf of peace. Fifty-four percent believe that IDF killings of Palestinian civilians lead to more terror. Sixty-one percent are opposed to collective punishment (Israel's current policy toward Gaza).
...Eighty-one percent will support "any peace deal" agreed to by Israel with its Arab neighbours. One should keep this fact in mind when listening to the geshrei from the Orthodox community, which calls any territorial compromise on Jerusalem a betrayal of the Jewish people. Only a very small minority of American Jews agree.
... Aipac itself earned only a 38% favourable rating...
All this again shows the weakness of Aipac when it is viewed in the context of the overall Jewish community. The hawkish policy pronouncements of the Israel lobby and specifically Aipac represent little more than themselves and their members when it comes to the Israeli-Arab conflict. The majority of American Jews don't agree.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2008/jul/25/israelandthepalestinians.usforeignpolicy
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nikkibabe1 year, 4 months ago
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Endoscopy1 year, 4 months ago
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nikkibabe
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Russia under former KGB leader Putin is trying to regain the areas lost when the USSR collapsed. That is part of what is happening here if you don't understand it. Then all you can do is talk about Iraq in ignorance of what is happening in the world.
Muslim terrorists abound.
Russia is currently attacking the capital of Georgia.
Death and destruction in several countries where genocide or close to it is going on.
You only want to comment about Iraq when it is getting more peaceful as more and more terrorists are being killed more and more by Iraq troops and police. The US has pulled out most of the surge and as things get better the plan is to remove more as the situation warrants. Gee that is Obama's plan now since he went there. He is saying the same thing as McCain now.-
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coolslow1 year, 4 months ago
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Good going Endo! Weren't you impressed when Obama came back from Afghanistan and boldly declared that the problem there stems from drug money funding the Taliban and then they flee to the NorthWest Frontier Province in Pakistan. What insight!!! Why didn't the rest of us see that??
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Then on to Berlin. Hurray for Harry Truman, John Kennedy, and Ronald Reagan, bold and good stuff from all three of them in Berlin. Thanks Obama for pointing that out, (and kinda taking the credit) . Then the big cheer line" the US needs allies in the world." APPLAUSE. He should have done the right thing and asked our allies, the Germans, for more troops in Afghanistan and to allow them to fire their weapons.-
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Progressive1 year, 4 months ago
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As a matter of fact, Obama did ask Angela Merkel for more troops in Afghanistan and she agreed to send more. McCain returned from his trip to Germany during the primaries declaring he'd had a good talk with its "President Putin", if I recall correctly.
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buckncindykill1 year, 4 months ago
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You got that right Ranch. His first statement was the Obama 'generic condemnation of violence in the World' template, unedited. It could have applied to any conflict, right down to the neighborhhod kids in fisticuffs on the schoolyard.
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The second statement was indeed after someone explained to him that this was not Georgia, the state, and found the right chapter in Cliff Notes for the 'Foreign Policy for Dummies' book for him. -
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Searchbeam1 year, 4 months ago
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buckncindykill1 year, 4 months ago
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"I condemn Russia's aggressive actions and reiterate my call for an immediate ceasefire... Russia must stop its bombing campaign, cease flights of Russian aircraft in Georgian airspace, and withdraw its ground forces from Georgia."
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Guess who said this. And just how will he back these statements up when Russia flips him off? By saying please?-
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SayNO2Obama1 year, 4 months ago
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Nikkibabe, hahaha! But what is even funnier than your post is the FACT that OBAMA says he has been to ALL 57 STATES!!!! WONDER IF HE CAN FIND THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA ON A MAP????!!!!!
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I guess they added some states I didn't know about......but isn't it funny that that there are "57" ARAB provinces??? HUMMM?? Didn't think so.
So dumb and DUMBER! I guess OBAMA's strong words telling "both sides in this conflict should show restraint". Ahhhhh......APEASEMENT!! And we ALL know how well THAT works.....don't we?? Sheesh!-
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Charlson1 year, 4 months ago
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Say no to SayNO2Obama. There is no one dumber than the goof you support. Appeasement could be construed as buying the loyalty and help of Sunnis after they've been killing our troops. Appeasement could be giving food and oil to North Korea to so they wouldn't pursue nuclear weapons of mass destuction. Appeasement could also be giving hand outs to big oil while they are having record profits. Sheesh!
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Mdiar1 year, 4 months ago
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It wasn't sarcasm. If you read the full statement, Obama was tired and accidentally said "50" instead of "40". He meant to say he visited forty-seven states, was not allowed to visit Alaska or Hawaii for some reason and so he had one more to go to visit every state.
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I'm also going to take this opportunity to point out that there are not 57 Islamic countries in the world, there are 60. So that little "sleeper Muslim" factoid is incorrect, by one SayNO2Obama.-
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Endoscopy1 year, 4 months ago
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I heard the statement of Obama. He started by saying he had been to all 57 states. The audience tittered. He said that he had one more to go. Then the audience laughed louder. Then he said his staff would not let him go to Hawaii or Alaska. They laughed even louder. All the time he had that deer facing headlights look because he could not understand why the laughter.
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Nobody that has had a real education in the US would ever make that mistake. How many times have you had to take tests with naming the states, placing them correctly on a map, and knowing their capitals. How many times have you had the number 50 or for me 48 drummed into your head. I have a problem remembering the capital of Alaska because they changed it within about a year after becoming a state.
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nikkibabe1 year, 4 months ago
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buckncindykill1 year, 4 months ago
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A slip of the tongue nikki, much like Obama said we have 47 contiguous states or something like that.
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But really, calling for NATO to convene and discuss options is no worse than calling on the UN to impose sanctions is it not? Actually, do we really think the UN will do anything? At least NATO has some teeth, and by accepting Georgia membership into NATO (which is what the talks would accomplish) might just make Russia back off.-
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Endoscopy1 year, 4 months ago
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I don't know which of the two of you is the more ignorant. Donald51 only knows how to make ad hominem attacks like above and your post is totally incorrect.
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The quote of Obama was correct. He said he had been to all 57 states. He later compounded it into there being 60 states at that time.
The two original players in the Iraq War were Iraq under Hussein and the Allies headed by the US. Several countries were and are there including the United Arab Republic.
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Endoscopy1 year, 4 months ago
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nokkibabe
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ROTFLMAO
Apparently you didn't know that McCain has been there. He has done extensive travel around the places in the world where US interests are. By doing that he understands what is going on in a lot of the world. But don't let facts bother your far left view of things.-
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CaptainLucid1 year, 4 months ago
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Being there and knowing what is going on are 2 completely different things. The queen of England and Miss America have been all over and met lots of leaders. I wouldn't want either one in charge of policy. McCain would do well there. He has a legacy in the navy which is the closest thing we have to royalty here. He always smiles and never forgets his flag pin. Sometimes he forgets things like countries just like Miss America may forget which mall opening she is at. McCain reminds me of when Ross Perot named Admiral Stockdale as his VP. In the middle of the debate he admitted that he had no idea why he was there. McCain should just shut up, smile, and accept his role. Watching McCain now is like an old boxer trying to make a comeback but life isn't like the movies. Some of his loyal fans and corner men are telling their guy what to do but as soon as its time to perform he just bumbles around while the other guy shines. No one wants to tell him how badly he is *********** himself.
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dunkirk1 year, 4 months ago
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Mclame has been there? The question is does he remember being there. He understands what is going on there? Only if its on a notecard and hes told this is what you understand. When left to his own devices he meanders all over the place enough to say he has no clue about economics yet is proposing economic plans to right the mess of the Dumya. When giving speeches he often contradicts things hes said in speeches prior (some given a few hours earlier) so Id question him understanding very much since his pattern is to forget his stand on issues he's took a stand on a few hours previously.
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Ruggaboo1 year, 4 months ago
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Russia is seizing an oppurtunity to crush a rival...to smash a developing democracy.
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The Russian's have done nothing in years...excepting oppress and enslave their neighbors,
spread a commie agenda across the globe and ruin ASIA.
Georgia struck against it's own territories...not Russia.
Russia is the same old goon show run by KGB criminals and thugs.-
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Ratskii1 year, 4 months ago
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I thought your hero, Reagan, crushed the communist soviet union? Now you're saying it isn't so? Interesting.
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By the by, as the article says, Ossetians have had problems with the Georgians from long before there was such a thing as communism.-
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Mdiar1 year, 4 months ago
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They do. However, Russia does not have the right to take Georgia back, and that is what they are doing unless I'm greatly mistaken. Make no mistake, this is a power play by Putin, akin to the same power plays you've been seeing out of the United States lately. Russia is not trying to be the nice country anymore then the United States is. Both are serious threats to world peace.
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Candida1 year, 4 months ago
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That is quite possible. My question though is: Why doesn't Georgia let the Ossetians decide where they want to belong? That would have avoided the Russian intervention. I have no love for Russia, and especially for Putin, but Georgia isn't the innocent victim here either. If they really believe in democracy, they should let the Ossetians decide their own destiny. Just because they belonged to Georgia for administrative purposes during the era of the Soviet Union, it doesn't mean that they must belong to Georgia forever.
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Mdiar1 year, 4 months ago
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I agree with you. My issue is when people try to paint Russia as an innocent victim replying to American/Georgian aggression. You didn't, of course, but I have been stating as much as possible (without spamming) that this is a power play.
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Russia, in thirty years, will be very dangerous.-
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Georgia501 year, 4 months ago
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The way Russia sees it, it already has a superpower on one border that it cannot do anything about. Both Russia and China have sizable, restive Muslim minorities agitating for separatism. Either two dynamics pose unknown risks for Russia.
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A NATO ally on its border adds to Russia's complications. Call Putin wrong, brutal, dictatorial, or whatever, but I believe the goal is to keep Russia's poker hand as simple and manageable as possible.
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nikkibabe1 year, 4 months ago
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Why my comments on McCain reverberates with a Obama line? I am just calling the shots on an old ignorant hypocrite and his antics out of PURE ignorance combined with early signs of ALZEIHMERS.
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McCain looks like the guy who drives the courtesy shuttle at the car dealership.
McCain looks like the guy who fights with drivers over Handicap parking spots
McCain looks like the guy who keep gazing at the pendalum in a grandfather clock
McCain looks like the guy who sits at the information desk at a geriatrics center.-
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Endoscopy1 year, 4 months ago
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Must be nice to have such a clear image of people like yours. You looked at the issues like the fact that McCain travels to all parts of the world while Obama had to be goaded into making a campaign trip the several countries in a week. But McCain is ignorant and Obama is all knowing. Such insightful commentary.
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You must be one of the beautiful people who rate people on their looks. You can understand what a person is by looking at them. Such intuition. Maybe you should go to the UN and give them your expertise. -
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BB641 year, 4 months ago
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Do you often judge books by their cover?
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Barry looks like one of those smart whine and cheese eating guys that does nothing but blame America for all of the world's ills. Putin invades a sovereign nation, it's Bush's fault. Gas goes up to $ 4.00/ gallon, Bush's fault. China gets the Olympics, Bush's fault. Bret Favre gets traded to the Jets, Bush's fault. Edwards has an affair, Bush's fault. Okay, I know I went way overboard. But you know what I'm talking about.
I'm not a McCain fan, but at least I have some idea where the man stands. Barry on the other hand hangs out with defendants, racists and former terrorist. He votes only along the Chicago DNC party lines. Has never crossed the isle to use the restroom much less to talk to a non-DNC member. He's clearly not an agent of change.-
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dunkirk1 year, 4 months ago
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ROFLMAO, yeah but to listen to you clowns and your rationalizations on the problems of the nation today is amazing. We have had 8 years almost of failed REPUBLCIAN eceonomic policy BUT its CLintons fault. We've watched an entire city be washed off hte map without Bush responding in a competent or even meaningful matter (had a gold fundraiser to attent) BUT thats Clintons fault. The was in Iraq is based on a series of lies pushed by the moron in the ovel office BUT thats Clintons fault.
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What should be taken from all the whining hte right does about how things are all CLintoins fault is that after more then 7 years of being out of office the REPUBLCIANS STILL cannot fix ANY of the wrongs they seem to want to blame CLinton for.
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jesh1 year, 4 months ago
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He said that the UN should be involved isn't that what we should do. Condemning aggression and saying they should with draw. How many times have I heard a commander and chief say that? I didn't hear anything that could be described as “McCain goes berserk “the person that wrote it wouldn't be an Obama supporter could he????
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Endoscopy1 year, 4 months ago
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LOL
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They are going to the UN famous for doing nothing wanting everybody to lay down their weapons. This at a time when their tanks are attacking the capital of Georgia. And you believe a KGB man?
For this attack to go this fast and far it had to be planned a while ago.-
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dunkirk1 year, 4 months ago
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ROFLMAO, Kinda odd then that we invaded Iraq using supporting one of the resolutions passed by an organization that does nothing. Altho laying their arms down and working toward peace has to be pretty abhorent to you Cons. People dieing for your economic gain is pretty typical of the REPUBLCIANs these days, Oh yeah I forgot unless of course that waarfare involved you, then its peace at all costs.
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fsev411 year, 4 months ago
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lloydm651 year, 4 months ago
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There is no comparison between McCain,and Obama.An american leader vs a Chicago street organiser.McCain will lead not falter, Obama by nature is a pacifist,except when attacking america's values.He,and his crowd have condemmed america for WW2,Korea, and all other conflicts.A president who can't embrace our historical past,and recognize how, and why we struggled for our independence,and gave aide to other countries to breathe free needs to do what he does best.Street organiser,
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quackpot1 year, 4 months ago
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Please substantiate this atatement of yours.
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"He,and his crowd have condemmed [sic] america [sic] for WW2,Korea, and all other conflicts"
Note that America should be capitalized for maximum patriotic effect
Obama has been a consistent supporter of issues that are of importance, while McCain has consistently voted against benefits for Vets. Their respective voting records are FACT and are CLEAR.-
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Endoscopy1 year, 4 months ago
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Their voting records are very clear. Obama is the farthest left wing voting record in the Senate. That with not voting while campaigning. McCain is mostly Conservative and some middle and liberal votes. That much is very clear. So if you want an extreme left wing person vote Obama. His web site is tax and spend out of sight. If you want someone more middle of the road and more conservative then vote for McCain.
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Of course to quackpots the radical point of view is best. Tax, tax, tax, spend, spend, spend, and deficit out the kazoo. This goes along with the radical hatred of the military.
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Endoscopy1 year, 4 months ago
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ROTFLMAO
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I have listened to a lot of left and right wing talk show hosts. Why have the left wing ones almost disappeared? Could it be that they didn't get enough ratings? Without ratings a radio station will drop a show.
You obviously don't know the origin of ditto with relation to the Rush Limbaugh show. Early on there were callers that said they agreed and praised him for his stands on issues. A caller then said ditto to what a previous caller said about that. Ditto became the method of saying agreement and praise for what Rush was saying.
Therefore you have it backwards. Dittoheads listen because they agree with what Rush is saying. As soon as that stops he will be history.
Of course liberals just repeat what Soros through moveon.org and mediamatters.org says. He transmits it and the little liberal robots parrot him. Is this correct since he says that he bought and paid for the Democrat party?
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thoughtforsale1 year, 4 months ago
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Mr. Saakashvili would have been an extraordinary fool, if he had dared to stand up against Russia and try to avoid Georgian seperatist efforts, without having an American promise of support backing him. Saakashvili was a protegee of the US, who calculated with the Olympic peace and was let down at the end. I don´t really know, why John Mc Cain ignored Russia´s appeal to the UN, just to make the same proposition. Perhaps, he wanted to demonstrate that there won´t be any more exclusive military actions by the US. Perhaps, he wasn´t able to accept that Russia did the right thing just a little bit earlier? All I wish for the Caucasian region is peace, as soon as possible. There already seem to be some signs of goodwill, so hope is the last to die! The roots of the conflict go much deeper. They might have something to do with a damaged Russian self-esteem, but there is time enough to analyze the reasons, when the weapons are laid down!
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Endoscopy1 year, 4 months ago
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ROTFLMAO
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"He got thrown under the bus by dumbya, just like Saddam Hussein was by big daddy bush."
What a rewrite of history. The Democrats under Bush 1 held him to just freeing Kuwait. He was forced to not send troops into Iraq at that time. So Bush 2 had to clean up the Democrats mess.-
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miklkit1 year, 4 months ago
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http://www.bushflash.com/thanks.html
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miklkit1 year, 4 months ago
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http://therratedblogger.blogspot.com/2007/01/thanks-for-memories-saddam-hussein.html
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The first link died. This one works, I hope.
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Endoscopy1 year, 4 months ago
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George Bush Senior didn't send troops into Iraq to bring down the government of Iraq. There might have been some tactical incursions to attack the troops in Kuwait. Read your history if you don't remember what happened. When the troops had been kicked out we shut down our war machine and went to shutting down the oil field fires started by Hussein's troops.
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George Bush Jr. did invade Iraq with several allies to enforce several UN mandates that Saddam was ignoring.
Read your history if you can't remember.
That second link just gives a picture. So what.-
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fsev411 year, 4 months ago
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Senior didn't send troops into Iraq because the UN mandate under which the coalition of nations (many more countries cooperating than under the Bush 2 fiasco) were operating called for the removal of Iraqi troops from Kuwait. When that was accomplished the UN goal was achieved. And if you'll check you find that Mr Cheney stated (and its on video) that it would be a mistake to try to go to Baghdad and depose Saddam as it would create a chaotic situation in Iraq that we could not control.
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Perhaps you should read the history.
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Shadowolf1 year, 4 months ago
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...boy, Endo needs to clean his scope out; he is mentally constipated...can't pass a clean thought..GHW Bush was smart enough to know that going into Iraq would be biting off more than he could chew...Hell DykeHead Cheney even has a video of him self explaining precisely what would happen if we went in...precisely what DID happen...but the politiskanks here just wanna rewrite it so as to minimize how wrong they were from the word go while they accuse everyone else of lying...
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ningyo1 year, 4 months ago
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the dems were all against what they called our illegal war and occupation of a country that didnt attack us and posed no threat to our security--where is this same rhetoric directed against russia for invading georgia--oh right ...its a communist country ...they must have a good reason...it must be our fault for trying to protect a democratic pro-western ally by letting join nato---
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ConsAreNonGrata1 year, 4 months ago
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More of the Cons' Culture of Lie and Incompetence.
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Cons, once more, Georgia STARTED it. Russia is FINISHING it.
Don't like it? Too bad. You set the precedent for a nation to push its interests by invading another.
The chickens have come home to roost, Cons.
Time to reap what you sowed.
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lorenvic71 year, 4 months ago
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McCain has it right and we need to wake up the world is not a goo-die good place it is a very dangerous place. wake up remember vladimer ptin is a self appointed dictator and is from the KGB as you can see who is running this war and the Russian news media with a plan to revive the old soviet empire and this was planned months in advance.
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jayfred1 year, 4 months ago
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For Georgia to invade South Ossetia with Russian troops and tanks clearly massed near the border verges on idiocy, or a dependence on neocon Bush administration assurances to go ahead with our backing. Which also verges on idiocy. Given the history of the region, that's like walking up to a bear and kicking it in the ass. It will not end well. And let's not forget, Georgia gave the world Josef Stalin and about 50 million dead Russians.
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Endoscopy1 year, 4 months ago
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Absolutely. It is his fault that China didn't clean up their air. The genocide in Dufar is his fault. The terrorists that damaged the USS Cole and killed some sailors was his fault. Bush is at fault for every grade my kids made under an A.
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Of course everything is his fault. I agree.
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Endoscopy1 year, 4 months ago
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No military goes into action without:
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1. Planning
2. Logistics
Both take a while to set up. You don't send people into an attack without fuel, food and ammunition among other things to support them. For them to be attacking the capital of Georgia that all had to occur. It doesn't happen over night. -
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BB641 year, 4 months ago
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Knowing the Russian military and their "terrific" abilities, this would have had to be planned and supplied way in advance. The forces that hit here were very large, not a small striker battalion. This would have required logistical support for food, fuel and equipment. Normal front line bases typically wouldn't have enough supplies to complete a full invasion like this.
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jovial1 year, 4 months ago
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Love that headline. McCain goes berserk! A quick glimpse into a McCain Presidency. You see since he's going into the election pretending to be a tough guy. Any country that provokes us or disturbs our militaristic foreign policy, will be subject to military attack. McCain has painted himself into this corner. If McCain tried to use diplomacy, they would say he's acting like Obama. So he would by his own election pledge have to be a "berserk" to pacify the people that voted him into office.
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Ratskii1 year, 4 months ago
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Guess I have more questions than answers on this one:
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1) If Georgia is such a democracy, why is it willing to shell and bomb its own civilians causing thousands of casualties?
2) Why are certain establishment liberals suddenly in such heartfelt agreement with the neocons?
3) Is Saakashvili stupid enough to believe that a U.S. and NATO bogged down elsewhere, would come to his support with actual troops, or is he playing a longer game? -
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abntv1 year, 4 months ago
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Why dont all you self professed experts fix the problem yourselves? Whenever a problem breaks out somewhere around the world Propeller is full of comments by you experts on how things should be handled. The answer always seems to be to call the people you disagree with cute little made up names and rarely offer anything of substance.
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Candida1 year, 4 months ago
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I don't know. I've seen quite a bit of substance in this thread and relatively few cute little names. Your comment, on the other hand, is directed against the commenters and has nothing to do with the story itself. It could be inserted into any thread. Have you even read the story? Or are you against debate in general? If so, why do you bother taking part?
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abntv1 year, 4 months ago
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Or like most of mcclames
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Yeah but when you use Flush Limpaw
eh...... mccgoo wants nato to do something
this idiot McBush
Dumya couldn't condemn Israel for escalating to all out war
Now McSame is demanding that they go to the UN.
Everyday the dittoheads blantantly repeat the comedian el Rushbo's
I didnt even make it to the bottom of the page for that list.
And I read the story far enough to figure out that it was nothing more than a biased smear. I happen to enjoy debate..I do not enjoy idiotic name calling. If someone posts a legitamte story about this issue I would be happy to join a debate... -
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markmawn21 year, 4 months ago
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Some additional articles to get a bigger picture on this:
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Georgia President Oops'd: http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/europe/article4500160.ece
Look at this list of Naval ships being assembled:
http://www.rense.com/general82/begin.htm
Excerpt:
"As Russian troops and air force pilots, and thousands of Russian civilians die in combat in Europe for the first time since 1945, only miles from their homeland (on land that was part of the Russian Empire and Soviet Union for centuries), the sleeping Russian Bear has been awaken and filled with a terrible resolve. The fact that only within the last few weeks have the 1,000+ American Marines - sent in to train the Georgians for this very war - left is not overlooked by the Russians."
"The fact that (according to DEBKA the well-connected Israeli strategy and military site) over 1,000 Israeli "mercenaries" are actively engaged in combat with the Russian Army on the side of the Georgians is also not overlooked. The fact that the American neo-con administration and the Israelis have been engaged in a fury of advanced arms sales and deliveries over the last year, and that these weapons are killing Russians on their own historic territory, is not overlooked."
Never mind that Bush revealed in his condemnation that this was not going as planned. Planned? -
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mn81 year, 4 months ago
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"Gentlemen, comrades, do not be concerned about all you hear about Glasnost and Perestroika and democracy in the coming years. They are primarily for outward consumption. There will be no significant internal changes in the Soviet Union, other than for cosmetic purposes. Our purpose is to disarm the Americans and let them fall asleep." Mikhail Gorbachev
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abntv1 year, 4 months ago
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"Wikipedia "The word "berserker" today applies to anyone who fights with reckless abandon and disregard to even his own life, a concept used during the Vietnam War "
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Just where other than Wikipedia can a person find reference to berserker and a concept used in the Vietnam War????
McCain proposes that NATO look into the problem and you come up with berserk and irrational//
Me thinks the pot is calling the kettle black.-
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Shadowolf1 year, 4 months ago
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Ab; actually, the word was coined by the Vikings...sorta...The Viking warriors wore tunics of bear hair (beirsark, I think it was spelled) that their enemies thought gave them their legendary fighting abilities...
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...over the next couple of centuries, (as so frequently happens) the word morphed into 'berserk' and the definition into the familiar " fighting without regard for ones safety or life"...
(Back in high school, had to do report on the mead chugging psychos...apparently some of it stuck) -
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bigurn1 year, 4 months ago
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Barack Obama has weighed in, and he is NOW saying that he was trying to get the international community to manage the peace process in South Ossetia. Really!
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Here's the link: /obama_claims_to_have_bee...html">http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2008/08/obama_claims_to_have_bee...html
If you can find a statement from a few months back that reinforces this, post it. Otherwise, he's a liar.-
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BB641 year, 4 months ago
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I can't believe how many people commented on this article. Besides being poorly worded and having numerous errors, it's little more than an editorial. Referring to someone as a bearded, pear-faced gun geek, hardly a comment from a real reporter.
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What happened to relevant real new articles that used to be a part of the old netscape?-
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BB641 year, 4 months ago
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The UN isn't the place to go here. We need to have the NATO Nations sit down and work this out now. Russia or the new USSR needs to answer for this attack. This wasn't simply an over reaction. Their forces aren't that well supplied nor equipped. NATO needs to be prepared, the Bear is back. Who will be next? Lithuanian, Estonia, Latvia, the Ukraine or Poland?
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It's time to offer US military in the form of Pershing 2 missiles or some other strategic threat they would be concerned with. We wouldn't need to deploy this but I suspect a threat like this is more fearful then a few bombers in Cuba. I think since they attacked Georgia and we need to take one of their allies. Let's take Cuba. Good cigars, oil, warm weather. I'm only kidding about Cuba, but we need to make Russia pay in some form. Flood the markets with fighter planes. Arm our allies with F18's, F-22's, A-10's, M-1A1's, Ground launched AMRAAM - CLAWS, MIM-104 Patriot and the like. If they want to play games, we still can out build and out design them. I suspect Putin would back down to the threat of a united NATO before any real armament occurred.-
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CaptainLucid1 year, 4 months ago
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Damn BB64. You win my idiot of the year award. First I don't think that most NATO countries would want to stick their weiner in this hornets nest. Only the chimp and McBush would be dumb enough to do that. Russia or the new USSR? By making this statement you show that you have absolutely no clue which countries or foreign republics are on which side. I know for sure you don't know why each side is lined up the way they are. Here's a hint. OIL. You are also incorrect when you state that Russia attacked. If you flood the market with planes who will buy them? Our allies already have what they want. The only way to sell them would be to an enemy but what is the point in that unless you are a neocon. Neocons make money selling weapons to everyone, then by supporting the armies, then by rebuilding the mess they created. Neocons profit from death and destruction. Neocons rise to power by dividing and spreading hatred among groups and feasting like vultures over the leftovers. Neocons are the new Satan and W is the antichrist.
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icono11 year, 4 months ago
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FTA
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"We should immediately call a meeting of the North Atlantic Council to assess Georgia's security and review measures NATO can take to contribute to stabilizing this very dangerous situation," McCain said. "
How is that statement a declaration of war?
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