Moscow warns it could strike Poland over US missile shield »
Posted By gamahuche 1 year, 4 months ago in NewsMoscow reserved the right to launch a nuclear attack on Poland because it agreed to host US rockets as part of the Pentagon's missile shield.
Read Full Story at guardian.co.uk »
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gamahuche
"I would rather be a square peg than fit in a pigeon hole" -
an essay which won me the "Lamb Essay Prize" at the Religious ...
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gamahuche1 year, 4 months ago
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While the apparent focus of action is in the Caucasus, in Georgia the signing of the deal between the US and Poland for a missile base in Poland has provoked the threat of a nuclear attack on Poland..
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It looks like the new Cold War is rapidly getting warmer.-
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Candida1 year, 4 months ago
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Definitely. Poland "has won a mutual security pact with Washington." Those mutual security pacts are great for starting world wars.
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I grew up hating Russians, but now I can understand that they feel threatened. I agree with them that the story about building a defense shield in Poland against Iran is a fairy tale.
Yes, they do bully, intimidate and coerce other nations, but why should the US have a monopoly on that? -
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gamahuche1 year, 4 months ago
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FTA:
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The risk of a new era of east-west confrontation triggered by Russia's invasion of Georgia heightened yesterday when Moscow reserved the right to launch a nuclear attack on Poland because it agreed to host US rockets as part of the Pentagon's missile shield.
As Washington accused Russia of "bullying and intimidation" in Georgia and demanded an immediate withdrawal of Russian forces from the small Black Sea neighbour, Russia's deputy chief of staff turned on Warsaw and said it was vulnerable to a Russian rocket attack because of Thursday's pact with the US on the missile defence project.
"By deploying, Poland is exposing itself to a strike - 100%," warned Colonel General Anatoly Nogovitsyn. He added that Russia's security doctrine allowed it to use nuclear weapons against an active ally of a nuclear power such as America.
The warning worsened the already dismal mood in relations between Moscow and the west caused by the shock of post-Soviet Russia's first invasion of a foreign country.-
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Candida1 year, 4 months ago
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The US has no moral leg to stand on regarding the invasion of Georgia. Condoleezza Rice said:
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"You can't be a responsible member of institutions which are democratic and underscore democratic values and on the other hand act in this way against one of your neighbours."
I get it; you can't do it to your neighbors, but you can do it at the other end of the world. Well, if she is serious, then I'm safe I guess.
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Mdiar1 year, 4 months ago
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Who really thinks Bush can stand up to Putin in a game of wits? Really? Maybe his father could, but not the son. Because we REALLY need that unproven missile defense shield... yup... just forget about the damned thing and put the savings into infrastructure or paying off the debt.
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lum-chate1 year, 4 months ago
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It's starting up the cold war again, The USSR disintgratred and collapsed economically & during the Reagan years they couldn't keep up in the arms race and were virtually bankrupt. The tables have turned Russia's economy is booming as their digging for oil in every nook and cranny of their huge land mass. The US depleted too much of our resources in Iraq & Afganistan really with nothing to show for it and if Pelosi, Reed and the far left policy of no drilling on American soil in order to "Save the Planet" prevails we might be in the same mess Russia was 2 decades ago.
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Bush seems to be doing the Teddy Roosevelt in reverse. SPEAK LOUDLY BUT CARRY A LITTLE STICK, bad stratagy indeed! -
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TheRealizer1 year, 4 months ago
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flyonthewallzz1 year, 4 months ago
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When I was 17 years old I spent some time in the mountains of West Virginia.
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I would like to think that I was helping some hard core hippies build their homes.
We where at least 12 miles from a paved road and in the mountains that can be a bit.
At any rate we pulled down an ancient log a barn and moved it to the property to build with.
In order to move it Lenny got the help of a couple of old time mountain folk and their 3-1/2 ton truck. Jake and Ellis had the truck, and drank from Ball jars shaking their heads and muttering “dumb F*cking hippies”. The stories I could tell would take up a full evening of good drinking.
Here is a snippet: after the Logs where dropped off way closer to the site than anybody thought possible, we where using work horses to pull stone up from the crick to lay the foundation, it was a good way up the hill.
Jake and Ellis showed up with their jar, they looked at us with scorn, Muttering “Only a dumb f*cking hippie would role rocks up a hill!” They hauled ass out of there, and a while later we heard the sound of their truck above us, and then the crashing sound of rocks rolling down the mountain toward us. It ended up that those where the ones we laid the foundation with.
I am going to end this comment with a tirade about the Patriot Missile.
Feel free to use the little triangle; I do think the links (Some .PDF sorry) give a ton of information, more than the bits I chose to quote. -
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flyonthewallzz1 year, 4 months ago
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http://english.pravda.ru/main/2002/10/15/38201.html
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I posted this link once before.
I just thought it gave a good example of the unexpected results that can come from screwing with Russian bears.
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gamahuche1 year, 4 months ago
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From the [U.K.] Guardian of 31st July
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http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2007/jul/31/comment.politics
Asked whether this might be the beginning of a new cold war, Putin replied: "Of course we are returning to those times. It is clear that if a part of the US nuclear capability turns up in Europe, and, in the opinion of our military specialists, will threaten us, then we are forced to take corresponding steps in response ... We are not the ones who are initiating the arms race in Europe."
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I know I've been throwing the "Cold War" expression around a lot lately but living here in the heart of Europe it feels very, very real indeed. I missed this article whan it appeared and found it just today through a Czech source.
The fallout from the Bush catastrophe will, I fear, be with us for a long time yet.-
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Mdiar1 year, 4 months ago
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Do you know the capabilities of the missile shield itself? I know as a defensive instrument its useless, but as an offensive one? I have to wonder just how worried Russia should actually be about this... personally, right now at least, I think Putin is just using the incompetent Bush and his Star Wars Jr. as an excuse to destabilize some NATO allies near him. The simple fact that Bush didn't realize he'd do this should be an indicator to everyone that he should have not been given the office of Presidency (which is such an incredibly weak office that I'm rather surprised that ONE President has caused so much damage, though six years of a Republican Congress helped him out some).
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Gransater1 year, 4 months ago
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This is just another nail in the coffin of making us feel safer, happy and content. Keep up the emotions of fear, while doing things that can be sprouted as protection, but in reality adds to the destabilisation of peace.
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I'm amazed that in an age, where the technology has gotten to, or is just about to get to where lethal mass destruction force can be carried by one person in a suitcase, either in the form of a vial of deadly virus, or, for image purposes, destructive force, we continue to strike at flies with a sledge hammer, rather than using a rolled up newspaper.
Delivery via intercontinental missiles is rapidly going the way of the 8 track tape, yet, we are spending massive amounts of money to protect us against it.
Isn't it time we concentrate our efforts on the home front, at the home front. We have issues to be resolved at home, and yet it appears that the idea is to let those issues be solved by their own creators. The result of that is the current lending crisis, just to give one example. I'm sure many are tired of eating cake. Let's go out and vote for something different.-
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CORVIDIVS1 year, 4 months ago
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"We have issues to be resolved at home, ..."
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i rather think there are also some issues much closer to home needing solving... right at home, in the form of a refreshening of personal awareness & ability.Personal power needs addressing in a big way if a ruled people is to have more sway in making a sort of MAD relationship with its chosen elected, ensuring that a president take on a likeness way away from the dynastic duos, etc., that we have witnessed.
WHETHER ADDRESSING PERSONAL advancement takes the form of going to church more to attain power from meditation,yoga,better diet,or education... Taking more personal control and responsibility is the wellspring of power for a society.
WE CAN GLIBLY whine & pine 'til the cows come home to roost,but accountability's buck really stops at john doe's doorstep...
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cloud151 year, 4 months ago
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Russia would never use a nuke. This is just like the cold war, make bluffs of using nukes to get the other nation to back off their plans. The term mutually assured destruction is important in this. If Russia uses a nuke, or any other country uses a nuke for that matter, they will be quite literally wiped off the face of the earth.
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lum-chate1 year, 4 months ago
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This Mikheil Saakashvili might be the most laughable leader of a so-called country in recent history. All he utters is the democracies of the world have to stand with him, the Russians are up to their usual tricks ranting about tactics of 40 years ago in the Prague Spring. He never stops ranting, can't be interupted. The same thing over & over again carrying on like a histerical women. Anyone who wants an ally like this sophmoric fool ought to have their head examined!
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Bush picks allies worse than he picks cabinet members. Even Alberto Gonzalez was a better Attorney General than Saakashvili is an ally.
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airwick1944Comment removed: Retracted by user
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cheif1 year, 4 months ago
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Let's get this clear...we put in a missile defense array, but if we put one in, Russia will try to destroy Poland with ................a missile...........
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cheeze; does that mean if we're trying to stop the plague or something, we send over shots to prevent them and the Russians destroy them to prove they're smarter and bolder than we are?
Aren't they aware they're considered infidels and could be part of the Muslim allahood strike against anything not muslim? Especially women and children...the allahood are deathly afraid of these types of infidels...Do they read papers over there in Russia? -
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kossack1 year, 4 months ago
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I'm a conservative. And I like to acknowledge anything that relates to conservation. So, here's the real news.
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Russia knows how to conserve energy. America, take note.
Russia is doing in its own backyard what usually takes America half way around the globe to accomplish: protecting its borders and interests. Russia is giving America a free lesson in the conservation of energy.
Go Russia!
Did I just say that? My bad. I keep forgetting only America has a right to exercise its sphere of influence. Which, by the way, is everywhere. Especially where there is oil and if its not in its own backyard.
But, hey, America is the good guy. Right? It can't help it. It is duty bound to help out other good guys wherever they are. Like Georgia. Georgia, who never did anything to anybody, ever. Especially after 12 midnight. While everyone is sleeping.
This 'crisis' should make America feel good. Its again another opportunity to stick up for the oppressed. You know, the way they did for that nice guy in Iran. The Shah. Who cares about Abhazia and South Ossetia and their natural advance to be independent.
Could it be Russia is picking up where America left off?
I remember when self-determination was a vital component of 20th century democratic ideology. It served America so well in foreign politics. For the last 50 years it was a successful underpinning to America's freedom to, among other things, monopolize self-serving global economic welfare, editorialize human rights abroad, exert powerful preemptive strikes and other leaps of various foreign intervention. Solicited and unsolicited.
Maybe that's why Russia isn't installing missiles in Cuba and pointing them at the U.S. ? You know, the way NATO already plans setting them up along the Polish border aimed at big bad Russia. America just wont stand for it.
No room for you Russia. America hates competition. Especially when it comes to orchestrating a cold war.
(Lest you think I'm ungrateful to America, I thank America for allowing me to write this here in the States . . . where its safe.) -
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nikkibabe1 year, 4 months ago
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When the President of Georgia speaks, it appears that he is scripted from White House, just like the "puppet" who calls himself PM of Iraq. These stuffed shirts can say and do anything for the bankroll coming from Bush and his war mongers.
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nikkibabe1 year, 4 months ago
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When the President of Georgia speaks, it appears that he is scripted from White House, just like the "puppet" who calls himself PM of Iraq. These stuffed shirts can say and do anything for the bankroll coming from Bush and his war mongers.
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BrattiKinz1 year, 4 months ago
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I wouldn't trust Russia , China, Iran, Cuba and Bin Ladin as far I throw. I say this, the US is best to stabilize within our own regions and that means depend on ourselves with our own oil field and refineries and let the Eastern world survive on their own. It shall come to pass we should be self sustained nation with our own resources. All these Neopolean type men want power. How many wars can we become involved with and how many more American soldiers can we enlist to send overseas to defend our own borders. The past presidents weakend our troops by cutting back defense expenses which is going to bite us back. I had always hoped in this 21 century by now we the world could all get along, Watching the Olympics gives us that space in time when all unite to compete and be supportive of their fetes and accomplishments. And I am thankful to watch such positiveness on this planet but maybe I was wrong, it's all about Greedy Power. In the end the innocent suffer! I hope whichever presidential candiadte comes in will send a message don't mess with the US. Mr. "W " has made us look like wimps like himself!
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JETCHARTER11 year, 4 months ago
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This war of wills between Bush an Putin only shows the mindset of Russia. Putin's true colors (old KGB) have finally surfaced as feared. His bold thrust into Georgia was just a test of the waters. However, if he thinks he's going to threaten Poland, he'd better think twice. He may be throwing rocks at the US, but he's breaking windows at NATO. A threat against any NATO member is a threat to ALL NATO members. Putin's attack on Georgia resulted out of its attemp to join NATO and he doesn't want any NATO country sharing a border with Russia.
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If the cold war is back, I feel sorry for the Russian people. They're the only ones who'll lose on this one.-
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PsychoHosebeastComment removed: Spammer, Abusive
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Spadecaller1 year, 4 months ago
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In the early sixties, when the Soviets installed nuclear missiles in Cuba only a few hundred miles from Florida, we went "ballistic". What's the difference? Putting nuclear warheads in Russia's backyard is a threat and is understandably seen as an act of aggression. .
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gamahuche1 year, 4 months ago
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Looks like a couple of hundred from Havana to Key West, about twice that far to Miami..
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I guess that you and I SC are relative veterans here and I'm sure that you remember the crisis really well. I was a student activist at the time in a smallish town in England and created a group act of civil disobedience on honour of this bellicose moment.
Yes, I remember it well too.
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Poulenc1 year, 4 months ago
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It should have been clear that Russia and China were key to world security in the twenty-first century; but instead of focusing on the ambitions, let's call it, of the former, Bush and Co. waged a war in Iraq.
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It now ill-behooves the current administration to admonish Russia for what we did in Iraq: unilaterally invade a country to intimidate regional leaders.
S-l-o-w-l-y, s-l-o-w-ly, Mr. Bush has awakened to Putin's dastardliness.
Though, of course, real action in regard to Russia will have to wait until a new president assumes office.-
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CHAM1 year, 4 months ago
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Poulenc and Spadecaller: Right on target. I just read a paper presented by some professors at a highly regarded University here in the USA. The topic was Political Conservatism and the one thing that really caught my interest was a section about Self-Image Enhancement.
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Discussing it with others that I had met when I was not able to use Propeller ( I began to use another site as my home page ), I ran across some very interesting comments about Self-Image and I noticed a common theme.
The self image presented by Republicans seemed to be that " The public should recognize that we are right in our philosophy basically because might makes right" while the Liberals ( The Republicans spell Liberal thinking Democrat ) seem to be less concerned about their self image and more concerned about the well being of the society.
The Bush Self Image is best described as " Things are what I say they are and if you don't agree I'll kick you ass" Conservatives seem to think this is the most important attribute of a leader.
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lum-chate1 year, 4 months ago
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Abkhazian leader Sergey Bagapsh said: “As for our independence and our movement to that goal, no one can stop us. We have this goal and we will go for it together.”
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They agree that they see no possibility for dialogue with Georgia.
“Georgia has only been independent for 18 years and it has already had seven wars with us,” Bagapsh said.
The South Ossetian President Eduard Kokoity thanked Russia for its efforts in helping guarantee its security. -
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