Irish Independent: Why the Israeli people have finally had enough »
Posted By israeligirl1 10 months, 1 week ago in NewsAnyone blaming Israel for the current crisis is either ignorant of the facts or shows moral cowardice. The civilian deaths in Gaza are to be mourned, but in a sick and twisted irony, they are mourned more by Israelis than by Hamas, who know that every dead Palestinian kid is worth another piece of propaganda.
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israeligirl1
I've been a marketing consultant to high tech companies for the last 10 years. I am also one of the founders of giyus.org ...
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engineer10 months, 1 week ago
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PsychoHosebeastComment removed: Spammer, Abusive5 Replies
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GrampyGas10 months, 1 week ago
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********. so basically the pro Israel side is saying anyone who doesn't side with Israel is a terrorist nutjob.
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If caring about human life, and not wanting civillians to die in a baseless attack is considered being a coward, then I don't want to know what you consider yourself as ..a God?
Propeller has such a pro Israel slant it's not even funny. Israel is occupying Palestine, I don't really care what happens about the land - I'm more concerned at how this attack is becoming pointless - it's an attack on the people, not on Hamas. They're killing more civillians then they are of Hamas - they kill families and kids, more then 46% of those dead are civillians the other 64% is comprised of either terrorists and those who's bodies are so charred or are unable to determine whether they were a civillian or not. These are stats coming straight from IDF - look it up yourself.
The ratio of deaths on Israel and Palestine is not even comparable, 3 Israelis died - and the death toll of Palestinians continues to increase it's already over 300. 3 Entire Families have been wiped out - that's entire families (aunts,uncles,fathers,mothers,children, grand children, grandparents etc). -
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hyperbola10 months, 1 week ago
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Even the Israelis under fire from Hamas see that the Gaza attack is just corrupt Israeli politicians running an election with bombs. In this thread we can see which posters here condone crimes against humanity for zionist racism.
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Even in Sderot, Israelis Say No to Gaza Attack
It has been widely acknowledged that Israel began a public relations campaign soon after beginning their bombing campaign over Gaza. As usual, they have had plenty of help. One example of this was Alan Dershowitz's article "Israel, Hamas, and moral idiocy" which ran in the Christian Science Monitor on New Year's eve. In a tired tradition, Dershowitz tries to blame the Palestinians for making Israel kill them.
...I've been to Sderot: just over a year ago in November, 2007. ... I saw the devastating effects of the missiles from Gaza. Even though there had not been a death from these rockets in recent memory when I was there, I was not surprised to find that the missiles had inflicted an incredible mental wound on the residents. But I was surprised to find that although the people of Sderot who I met wanted the missiles to end they understood that militarism would not protect them. The people I met with were not calling for war, they were calling for negotiation. ... Even an IDF commander I met told me, off the record, "The Qassams [missiles] are like stones, there is no way to stop them. The only way is negotiation."
Even more amazing, residents of Sderot are organizing to try to end the attacks. Read the text of this petition signed by hundreds of Sderot's residents which has been posted at the website jews sans frontieres.
Clearly not all people in Sderot agree with these views, as has been shown. But it's also clear that Dershowitz and other proponents of the endless war will always use the people of Sderot as the cannon fodder they need in the moment. The residents of Sderot are primarily Mizrahi Jews, poor and working class, who have been settled on the periphery to play exactly this role. As much as Dershowitz might want to fight to the finish, those in the crossfire just want an end to the shooting.
http://www.propeller.com/story/2009/01/05/even-in-... -
hyperbolaComment removed: Spam
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hyperbola10 months, 1 week ago
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Well is engineer advocating genocide again? Makes it seem like zionists are incorrigible "if it is my tribe, it can't be wrong" racists who will kill for a vile totalitarian ideology. We Americans should pay more attention to honest Israelis.
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Why Israeli Anti-Zionists do not recognize the right of the State of Israel to exist as a Jewish state
In recent times, the demand has been raised, by representatives of the State of Israel, and by its supporters abroad, to recognize the State of Israel’s “right to exist as a Jewish state”. I am told that this demand is a debater's trick that was invented by Henry Kissinger several years ago. Be that as it may, what, if anything, is wrong with this demand?
If the goal is a negotiated peace agreement, or treaty, there is no need for recognition of “the right of the State of Israel to exist as a Jewish state”. If the goal is to sabotage the possibility of a negotiated agreement, this demand has been placed front and center. A couple of other examples, just to illustrate the preposterous nature of the demand: Has anyone ever asked the Catholics of Ireland to recognize the right of Ulster, or Northern Ireland, to exist as a “Protestant state”? Would we recognize the right of any state to exist as a “Hindu state”? As a “Muslim state”? Just to pose the question is to expose its nature.
But, maybe we are not talking about “Jewish state” as a state affiliated to the Jewish religion. Maybe we are talking about a state that is defined by the dominant ethnicity. In that case, the position does not get any better.
...we have had our fill of states whose raison d'etre is to preserve ethnic superiority and domination. One does not have to refer to the late unlamented “Aryan state”. Within recent memory, we had white-supremacist Rhodesia and apartheid South Africa. Whatever limits there are to analogies from and to these white supremacist regimes, we have learned that states that define themselves with reference to the domination of one ethnic group cannot claim legitimacy.
Israel and its allies insist that the Palestinian victims of Zionism must “recognize Israel as a Jewish state with a Jewish majority.” No one seems concerned about the fact that this ultimatum flies in the face of elementary democratic values regarding human equality and human rights. Israel’s backers seek to legitimize that which is illegitimate by any standard of democracy. -
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hyperbola10 months, 1 week ago
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By the way, readers of propeller should be aware the "israeligirl" may be state military propaganda.
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Israeligirl Violates Digg TOS
But, one particular Zionist user stands out recently because of the number of articles this user has placed on the front page recently. And that user is IsraeliGirl. Here's her user profile page.
On that page, in the about section, it says:
I've been a marketing consultant to high tech companies for the last 10 years. I am also one of the founders of giyus.org, a pro-Israeli public diplomacy group.
So I went to GIYUS.org to see what kind of a group it is. There homepage is as you might expect.
http://giyus.org/
GIYUS it turns out is an acronym for Give Israel Your United Support. And here is what is displayed on the front page of GIYUS.org.
Today's conflicts are won by public opinion.
Now is the time to be active and voice Israel's side to the world.
Join the effort in 3 easy steps:
Download and install Megaphone desktop tool
Receive desktop alerts on key articles and surveys
Click alerts to easily voice your opinion
Help us by reporting relevant articles and surveys.
Together we can make a difference!
In case you don't now about Megaphone, it is described in Wikipedia as "the pro-Israel lobbying software tool". Here is an excerpt from the Wikipedia article on Megaphone.
The Megaphone desktop tool is a Microsoft Windows application distributed by the World Union of Jewish Students and other pro-Israel organizations, through the Giyus.org website. Released on July 19, 2006, it delivers real-time alerts about key articles, videos, blogs, and surveys to subscribers so that they can voice their opinions and work together to support Israel on the public opinion front.
So now you can see the relationship:
IsraeliGirl->founder of GIYUS.org->distributor of Megaphone->pro-Israel lobbying software->work together to support Israel
http://futurenewstoday.blogspot.com/2009/01/israel...
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orndorffter10 months, 1 week ago
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On both sides I worrie about the kids no matter who the are or where they come from. the children can help what is happening. so whos going to care and worrie about them? Looks to me nither side is worring, but I'am and I care they are unable to fight for themselfs.
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cheif10 months, 1 week ago
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All the Arab countries are not helping Hamas in this latest fiasco because they are sick and tired of their crap. They just won't leave it alone! They try to import rockets, so Israel blockades them. They shoot rockets over to Israel whenever they feel like it, even though there's supposed to have been a cease fire for the last 6 months, they never quit. By putting their launchers in schools, churches, mosques, etc...they know Israel will track the launch pattern back to where it originated and bomb it - thereby assuring what Hamas wanted to do - killing children and making the actions of Israel look terrible to the world. Anybody dumb enough to not see through their actions needs to stand in one of the Israeli towns and try to catch one of their rockets till you understand they won't quit until they're all dead - their ONLY purpose in life is killing all Israelis; the Palestinians are just pawns in their evil, cowardly ways. The civilians should get their chin up, begin killing the Hamas cowards, run them out of their country, and get this over with. The Israelis can't change the Palastinian government and get rid of these cowards, the people who live there have to do it...PLEASE...BEGIN TODAY!!! ENOUGH IS ENOUGH!!
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Dionys10 months, 1 week ago
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"They shoot rockets over to Israel whenever they feel like it, even though there's supposed to have been a cease fire for the last 6 months, they never quit. "
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They shot rockets into Israel after Israel invaded Gaza to kill some militants (which broke the treaty). Technically Hamas didn't break the treaty, they just didn't renew it at the end of the six month period because they felt Israel had broken it when they crossed into Gaza to murder people.
"By putting their launchers in schools, churches, mosques, etc...they know Israel will track the launch pattern back to where it originated and bomb it"
Do you have proof of this, or is it just more Israeli propaganda?
"even though there's supposed to have been a cease fire for the last 6 months, they never quit."
They did quit. During the six months of the cease fire. Which was broken when Israel crossed into Gaza.
"The civilians should get their chin up, begin killing the Hamas cowards, run them out of their country, and get this over with"
I'm in agreement in terms of getting rid of extremists who will use violence to further their ends. On both sides of the equation. -
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cheif10 months, 1 week ago
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All the Arab countries are not helping Hamas in this latest fiasco because they are sick and tired of their crap. They just won't leave it alone! They try to import rockets, so Israel blockades them. They shoot rockets over to Israel whenever they feel like it, even though there's supposed to have been a cease fire for the last 6 months, they never quit. By putting their launchers in schools, churches, mosques, etc...they know Israel will track the launch pattern back to where it originated and bomb it - thereby assuring what Hamas wanted to do - killing children and making the actions of Israel look terrible to the world. Anybody dumb enough to not see through their actions needs to stand in one of the Israeli towns and try to catch one of their rockets till you understand they won't quit until they're all dead - their ONLY purpose in life is killing all Israelis; the Palestinians are just pawns in their evil, cowardly ways. The civilians should get their chin up, begin killing the Hamas cowards, run them out of their country, and get this over with. The Israelis can't change the Palastinian government and get rid of these cowards, the people who live there have to do it...PLEASE...BEGIN TODAY!!! ENOUGH IS ENOUGH!!
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icono110 months, 1 week ago
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The use of human shields, especially women, children, and the old and infirm, is an old and effective tactic used by most, if not all, guerilla armies past, present, and probably in the future against cultures that value 'the quality of life' instead of the 'cult of death'.
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Not only is the tactic used effectively by current day 'media savvy' guerilla armies but in WW2 Stalin used the population of Stalingrad with their subsequent sufferings and deaths to bolster the resolve of the Russian army to fight the Nazi invaders.-
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rightfromwrong10 months, 1 week ago
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Castro didn't use them...all of the people in the hills and villages were on their side.
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Instead of them having to use innocents as shield maybe they could give Hamas some weapons and make it more of an even fight and maybe they can take down the prison walls surrounding Palestine.
Israel has made it a concentration camp.
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canadianrancher5710 months, 1 week ago
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For a moment I would like everyone on both side of this to stop and listen to something that I have been thinking about. When I look at the history of the US. I realize that there was a time in the western part of the country, or the wild west, that there was a mentality that is somewhat similiar to what is going on between Israel and Gaza. People carried waepons and if a dispute arose people used those weapons to defend themselves. What this led to though was an unending cycle of violence. The solution was to have a system of law. This was done to protect society in general and minimize the loss of innocent lives and also to stop the escalation of hostilities between parties. When I look at the world I see a community and I feel that as a community law and order must be maintained by an independant force. We do have such a group but for some strange reason those who formed this organization allowed certain countries a veto. I wonder how well the system of law would work in the US. if judges were allowed to veto legal action. The United States became a great country because of a constitution that treats all as equals and gives people rights, I feel that the world would be a better place if this process included all people.
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reidgator10 months, 1 week ago
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Canadian - for once, we agree. However, not everybody wants a "law and order" society with a "law & order" government where the power to govern lies with the governed (the people). Some people want a theocracy. Some want a "dictatorship", with their party in power.
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So what do we do?
Yes - we can continue to "preach the good news", but, many reject it and others simply do not believe it can work. In the meantime, innocent people (primarily children) are slowly and methodically being exterminated or subjected to horrible childhoods.
Will that be our legacy? We sat back, stayed out of the fight, and let millions of children live in horrible conditions or die, so we could preserve our "honor".
How pathetic we have become...
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jdhatl10 months, 1 week ago
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Collective punishment is collective punishment. If you are bombing children, it is a war crime. They are not responsible for Hamas. They have been born into a nightmare situation. The people of Gaza are desperate, and will keep taking desperate (and basically ineffective) measures because they can't just sit still and let themselves be slaughtered. The pro-Israeli side never answers the issue of the disproportionate amount of casualties vis-a-vie Israeli civilians. There is no comparison. Collective punishment is collective punishment, you can't rationalize it away.
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orndorffter10 months, 1 week ago
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No you can't, but seem as much as I keep talking about the children and them being lilled, its not right, God doed not like it, I look at those pictures of those little kids laying there dead and it breaks ny heart, that mostly all I have been saying is what about the children they are adults and know that there are children on both sides. Seems like no one cares, well I do. it makes no different to me who they are or wher they come from, now the laughter of the kids that once ring out well never be heard again because the adults can not stop this fighting they aer not going to grow up and be a kid or make up their mind in life what they want, because they cant, death took all that away from them, my comment about it are being graded down, but if they read what I told to read, everthing is not a bed of roses, This war has got to come to and end and soon, not for the sake of the ones who are doing all this ,but for the children on both sides. If not the children well vanish.
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HMMace10 months, 1 week ago
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THE JEWS ARE TOO SOFT...FOR FIFTY OR MORE YEARS THEY HAVE BEEN PUTTING UP WITH THE PALS--MUCH TOO LONG--THE JEWS SHOULD HAVE RUN THE PALS INTO THE SEA--FIFTY YEARS AGO...
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CAN YOU INAGINE WHAT A DIFFERANT WORLD THIS WOULD BE--WITHOUT THE PALS????
I SEE AGAIN--YESTERDAY--THE PALS KIDS WERE AGAIN THROWING ROCKS AT THE JEWISH SOLDIERS--NOW--JUST HOW DUMB IS THAT??THOSE RE THE SAME KIDS WHO WILL PUT ON BELLY BOMBS..FOR THIER FATHERS,,WHO HAVE NOT THE STOMACH TO DO THIER OWN DIRTY WORK..
THE PALS USE KIDS TO DO MENS WORK---SO--WHAT DOES THAT MAKE THE PALS??? LOWER THAN SNAKES IN THE GRASS..
IF THE JEWS RID THEMSELVES OF THE PALS--WHO WOULD CARE ?? WHO WOULD LIFT UP THIER ARMS AGAINST THE JEWS?? NO ONE WOULD...NOT THE IRANIANS, SYRIANS--NO ONE..AS THE PALS DIE--THE IRANIANS LAUGH..
WHEN WAS THE LAST PALISTINIAN SCHOOL BUILT???-
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orndorffter10 months, 1 week ago
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Then you tell me how to get rid of the hurt I feel when I see babys some 1 or 2 o3and4 years old , laying in a puddle of blood in threir homes. how am I supose to feel happy, not car or just say another one gone? I'm talking about both sides not just one. I Love Israerl but I can not stop feelimg the way I do.I wouldn't want someone to bomb and kill my children or ny grandchildren. Why dont you just come right out and say how Stupid I 'am for careing so much, I wish thats what you would have done because you make me feel Stupid for having a heart that care.I bet God understands me, and he is probley the only one who does.
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NatureboyComment removed: Spam
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Natureboy10 months, 1 week ago
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What a POS this propeller is.
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Lets try it again.
The article is another garbage piece of propaganda, painting a false picture of monolithic support and bogus, Bushlike "with us or against us" false dichotomy.
Even within the Jewish community, there is opposition to this atrocity. Read what the Shministim have to say-
http://jewschool.com/2008/12/29/14602/the-shminist...-
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Natureboy10 months, 1 week ago
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Or, he says in a separate post to thwart the dysfunctional spamkiller, watch this video on the orthodox Jews in New York City protesting Israel and Zionism -
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http://www.mystudydate.com/pg/blog/Martini/read/92...
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tikker6410 months ago
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has anyone ever realized that there never in the history of mankind a government or people named palestine or "palestinian"?! there was a british ruled palestinian mandate after ww1 but never a country.check wherever you wish--these are nomadic homeless wanderers kinda like gypsies were. none and i mean none of the other arab countries want them and with their disdain for israel it serves a twofold purpose to fund the extremism. they could get rid of israel and have a hillbilly arab nieghbor
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