French Echoes of the Israeli-Palestine Conflict »
Posted By hyperbola 10 months ago in ReligionIn the case of the Gaza conflict, the main version of neither-nor is to condemn in the same breath the Hamas rockets and Israel’s response, sometimes described as disproportionate. The very word “disproportionate” is in this case absurdly disproportionate compared to the disparity of forces involved...
...In reality, the basic problem stems from the principles on which Israel was founded, that is, that it is legitimate for certain persons, by virtue of a property acquired at birth (to be “Jewish”) to occupy the land of other persons on whom the accident of birth failed to confer that property. Invoking the Bible or the holocaust as justification for that occupation changes nothing as to its intrinsically racist character, that is, the fact that it is based on a crucial distinction between individuals solely related to their birth.
This racist aspect is clear to the victims and to all those who identify with them, especially the populations of the Arab-Muslim world and parts of the Third World, to whom the Zionist project recalls previous painful experiences of European colonialism. But it is almost never acknowledged in the debate in the West. It must be stressed that this is not a matter of “ordinary” racism, of the attitudes that are unfortunately held by many individuals – a subjective and largely passive racism, regrettable but with limited consequences. Here it is a matter of an institutionalized racism, enforced by the structures of the State. Now, it is usually such State racism that is considered in our Western democracies to be an attribute of the “extreme right”, and that is denounced as “incompatible with our values”, “contrary to modernity and the Enlightenment”, and so on. This is the racism that led to a general condemnation of Apartheid in the Republic of South Africa and its ruling ideology. The only exception is Zionism, even though it is an ideology that legitimatizes an institutionalized racism.
The whole Western discussion of the conflict is indirectly contaminated by this underlying racist vision....
...All these double standards rest finally on the idea that the initial colonization enterprise was legitimate, or else that it happened long ago and is not worth talking about. But both those attitudes deny the full humanity of the victims, which brings us back to the issue of racism. Just imagine the European reaction if the State of Israel had been establish in part of the Netherlands or the French Riviera, while driving out the people already living there.
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hyperbola
Military brat (14th generation American) with unassuaged wanderlust. By age 11, schools in four states and three foreign countries (in 3 languages). Left home at ...
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Thinker2210 months ago
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> ..the main version of neither-nor is to condemn in the same breath the Hamas rockets and Israel’s response, sometimes described as disproportionate. The very word “disproportionate” is in this case absurdly disproportionate compared to the disparity of forces involved...
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Someone has to explain to the authors of this opus that in this world wars are being fought with a goal to END them, not to match the damage done to each other. If the Allies tried to use "proportionate" response against the Germans and the Japanese during WWII that war would still continue.
The amount of force and effort during a conflict (ANY conflict) must be 'proportional' to the GOALS of the operation in question, not to the damage done by the other side or the amount of forces in their disposal. The moronic idea that Israel does not have the right to defend itself because it is stronger than the Palestinians or even all Arab forces combined is just that, moronic. Anyone who believes in this principle should ask himself/herself if he/she would recommend the US government to send a couple of airliners to slam into Kabul buildings as a "proportionate" response to 9/11... -
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dissent9 months, 4 weeks ago
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fta
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"At each new war waged by the West, certain leftist or pacifist movements fall back on a “neither-nor” position. “Neither Milosevic nor NATO”, “Neither Bush nor Saddam”, and, now, rejecting both Israel and Hamas in the same breath.
In all these cases, there is a triple problem.
* We ignore the difference in the relationship of forces.
* The aggressor and the aggressed are treated in the same way.
* And, worst of all, we act as though we were outsiders, above it all, whereas our governments are obviously not.
In the case of the Gaza conflict, the main version of neither-nor is to condemn in the same breath the Hamas rockets and Israel’s response, sometimes described as disproportionate. The very word “disproportionate” is in this case absurdly disproportionate compared to the disparity of forces involved. On the one hand, there is an ultra-sophisticated national army, navy and air force. When that force attacks, it does so to destroy infrastructures and terrorize an entire region by demonstrating its military superiority. On the other side, there are a few home-made missiles lobbed toward Israel, not in the hope of winning a battle, but rather to give a desperate sign that a dispossessed, enclosed and forgotten people are still alive. The rocket launchings being nothing but a means of rattling the bars of a prison, the aggressor is basically the power that has unjustly imprisoned an entire people, depriving them for decades of other means to make their existence known."-
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Thinker229 months, 4 weeks ago
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Someone has to explain to the authors of this opus that in this world wars are being fought with a goal to END them, not to match the damage done to each other. If the Allies tried to use "proportionate" response against the Germans and the Japanese during WWII that war would still continue.
Reply
The amount of force and effort during a conflict (ANY conflict) must be 'proportional' to the GOALS of the operation in question, not to the damage done by the other side or the amount of forces in their disposal. The moronic idea that Israel does not have the right to defend itself because it is stronger than the Palestinians or even all Arab forces combined is just that, moronic. Anyone who believes in this principle should ask himself/herself if he/she would recommend the US government to send a couple of airliners to slam into Kabul buildings as a "proportionate" response to 9/11... -
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Thinker229 months, 4 weeks ago
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> The rocket launchings being nothing but a means of rattling the bars of a prison, the aggressor is basically the power that has unjustly imprisoned an entire people...
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Someone has to remind the authors of this opus that prior to August, 2000 there was no "prison".... There were no checkposts, no closures, tens of thousands of Palestinians had jobs in Israel, Palestinian businesses thrived, Israel trained, armed and equipped 30,000 Palestinian 'police force' and even built an international airport in Gaza...
...and then Palestinians decided to start "rattling the bars" by rejecting the peae agreement and starting a terrorist war known as the Intifadah instead.
Eight and a half years later the "dispossessed, enclosed and forgotten people" still declare their willingness to continue their terrorist war against the Jews and it means that they're happy with its results. If it was not the case they would try a peaceful alternative instead.
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