Comments for Poles apparently fear loss of potential US missile bases; Czechs do NOT! »
Posted By gamahuche 9 months, 3 weeks ago in Political NewsAP's highly distorted propaganda story claims that Poland and the Czech Republic are opposed to the potential cancellation of the plan for these bases.
The Poles clearly have a different point of view than do the Czechs - whose citizens remains staunchly opposed to the project. Take the AP story with a BIG handful of salt and most likely as planted propaganda.
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gamahuche9 months, 3 weeks ago
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AAAARRRRGGGH!
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I just wrote an immnesely long and detailed introduction to this story explaining the very different histories of the Czech Lands and Poland over the last 4 centuries and why this issue has been playing to very different audience response here and in Poland and ultimately why the AP story is a piece of propaganda in as much as it attempts to conflate the very differing opinions in the two countries.
I idiotically forgot to save what I had written it before I failed to post it and I can't rewrite it now - it will have to wait for another day and another cue..
For now I can only briefly elaborate that 1] the Czech Republic is the second most pagan country in Europe - after Lithuania - while Poland is the most devoutly Catholic one. In as far as Czechs DO participate in organised religion, Protestants dominate over Catholics 2] The Czech and Polish histories have been extremely different and although, for example they were both ruled by the Nazis during the 2nd World War, Poland suffered massive destruction of many of its cities, whereas the physical damage to the Czech lands was relatively minor. The Poland of today is far larger than the Czech Republic and differs in two other important respects - first that it does have a sea-coast, which we do NOT and never have had, despite Shakespeare's reference to "the seacoasts of Bohemia". Though the Czech lands were dominated by foreign rulers for hundreds of years, despite everything, the culture and the continuity survived. -
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gamahuche9 months, 3 weeks ago
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Now here are some realistic figures regarding public opinion here:
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http://praguemonitor.com/2009/02/18/czechs-leave-b...
This article was posted TODAY and it represents an action by inhabitants of the immediate are around the proposed radar installation.However it also states a NATIONWIDE figure of opposition which has hardly altered since this idea was first mooted.
FTA:
The participants in the journey include teenagers as well as people in their 70s and mayors of 30 municipalities situated in the Brdy area, some 90km southwest of Prague, where the radar is to be built.
The main event is to take place in Brussels at 14:00 on Wednesday.
"We will put on white overalls to show that 70 percent of citizens of our republic who do not wish the radar are practically invisible for the Czech government," Tamas said.
He said awareness of the project is very low in the EP. The MEPs whom the radar opponents have met were shocked by the advanced stage of the negotiations with the United States and the extent of disagreement among Czech citizens, Tamas said.
About two thirds of Czechs reject the radar base according to public opinion polls.-
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hyperbola9 months, 3 weeks ago
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I am really tired of the propaganda fed to we americans by our media. It is disgusting that AP is run by the same corporations that profit from our military-industrial complex and have a big stake in feeding us such state propaganda. Personally I much prefer to read in the european press (well, I can handle english, german, spanish, italian and if really interested a bit of french) what they think - no comparison to what is "filtered" to americans by our media.
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A qeustion for you. Much of "western" europe seems to think that "eastern" europe fell much more strongly under the influence of the "neocons" than the longstanding members of the EU and needs to escape from that. Think so?-
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gamahuche9 months, 3 weeks ago
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"Much of "western" europe seems to think that "eastern" europe fell much more strongly under the influence of the "neocons" than the longstanding members of the EU and needs to escape from that. Think so?"
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I'll have to improvise on that a bit..
The main problem being that "Eastern Europe" doesn't really think of itself that way - plus since we all have different languages and there are no real solid links between many of those countries sometimes we have less direct information here ithann there is out on the internet - but most of THAT is getting filtered rather strongly..
I used to have quite a lot of contact with Budapest, for example and have a number of good friends down there with whom I communicate in English. Hungarian is one of the toughest languages in Europe. Poland is our next-door neighbour to the north and I've spent quite a bit of time there too, have lots of friends and former students. But traditionally the czechs and the Poles have a pretty stand-offish relationship with each other and I haven't yet been able to persuade my gf to venture into those hostile climes! So my news from the rest of Europe is pretty much what's out on the internet and some of that - like this story that I decided to pick on today is very propagandist and filtered. Even the factual content was flimsy - not even defining the dual roles which the Czechs and the Poles are supposed to play.
As far as why the Poles are much more willing to go along with this project that the Czech people are is because they feel more ill at ease about Russia than we do, I guess, But whether this is neocon influence or whether some silver has crossed the right palms - as it obviously has here to get our politicians on board --
gamahucheComment removed: Spam
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gamahuche9 months, 3 weeks ago
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I can only conjecture. Default if there's a question regarding corruption is that its more likely than not, unfortunately.
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I live in a world that is pretty far removed from the seats of power but nevertheless in even a small town a great deal of pump-priming gets done and I have other sources that do run much deeper. Sometimes its comical. Walking home one evening recently we happened upon a "present-giving" happening on the street. One of the parties being someone with whom we have to deal and with whom we're not on the best of terms he desperately tried to pass the parcel back but of course it was too late.
O.K. well I haven't answered your question yet but I have written myself to a reminder of a very interesting chapter in Czech/US politics which took place a good few years ago but still has some relevance today as regards Czech-US relations.
This was the visit of Bill Clinton and Madeleine Albright to Prague - which oddly enough the little chimp probably piggy-backed on, but BOY - did HE make all the wrong moves! He managed to upset the British Queen even more by frightening her flamingos with his arrival helicopter for openers.
I wrote about the Clinton/Albright/Havel/Hrabal story on propeller here:
Still looking but meanwhile I found this - http://www.propeller.com/story/2008/08/16/moscow-w...
Still relevant!-
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gamahuche9 months, 3 weeks ago
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Ah that spam catcher! This time I was prepared and saved,,
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this was the conclusion of the above:
OOPS! That other story has gone! I guess at some point propeller just cut everything past a certain age..
But I did find this too, along the way..:
http://www.propeller.com/story/2008/07/15/russian-...-
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hyperbola9 months, 3 weeks ago
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Thanks for the input gama. My closest direct experience is Switzerland and Germany (east and west) and my present reading is mostly based on news and opinion sources in those countries plus Britain and Spain. The time I spent in east Germany in the early 1990s tuned me in to some of these issues.
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gamahuche9 months, 3 weeks ago
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http://www.charlotteobserver.com/235/story/537987....
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This article is very interesting for 2 reasons:
1. that it makes clear that the Obama viewpoint is radically different than the Bush approach and that there IS some chance of doing businmess with Russia and
2. That its written by a young and well-connected young intern at Radio free Europe and that obviously his work is being checked for "political correctness" - in the real meaning of that term.-
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hyperbola9 months, 3 weeks ago
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Well, given the increasing fragility of the supply lines to Afghanistan, the Obama administration apparently is going to need Russia's help to be able to supply our troops in Afghanistan. If the US really piiissses off both Pakistan and Iran, we could end up with two armies cut off.
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BB649 months, 3 weeks ago
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These are anti-missile weapons and wouldn't be able to stop Soviet missiles. The weapons would be able to stop lets say an Iranian attack though. This was the same missile system Bush offered to share with the Russians. I'm still confused at why they're against this. Unless these missiles can do more or the Russians are looking to expand the Empire again. Again, this was a missile system we offered to work with the Russians, together.
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