Know-Nothing Christians Irate Over Obama Comments »
Posted By Spadecaller 7 months, 1 week ago in Religion
During a profoundly symbolic trip to Turkey the president assured the Muslim nation that America is not a Christian nation, sparking right wing cries that he’s “thrown Christianity under the bus.” The real problem here is the absence of religious literacy among the critics currently speaking in alleged defense of the Christian faith.
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Spadecaller
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Spadecaller7 months, 1 week ago
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Obama assured the Muslim nation that America is not a Christian nation; so why should that anger right wing Christians? What gives any religious body in the United States the right to demand exclusive representation of the country?
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Tangent0017 months, 1 week ago
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"Obama assured the Muslim nation that America is not a Christian nation..."
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The treaty of Tripoli did that a loooooong time ago. It even passed unanimously.
Here is article 11:
"As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion; as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquility, of Mussulmen; and, as the said States never entered into any war, or act of hostility against any Mahometan nation, it is declared by the parties, that no pretext arising from religious opinions, shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries."
The treaty was printed in full in several contemporary papers and there is no record of any public dissent. -
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hyperbola7 months, 1 week ago
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Actually the Muslim nations would do well to notice the major differences between Obama's rhetoric and his actions. Despite all the fine words, he is in fact ramping up the Pentagon to produce colonialist armies for attacks on Muslim nations. Whether that is a result of christianity (more likely pseudo-jewish zionism since those are the main propagators of propaganda favoring attacks on Muslim nations) or just plain imperialism is something for you to decide.
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Forget Star Wars. It’s Back To Colonial Warfare
There are a lot of unhappy campers at the Pentagon right now. US Defense Secretary Robert Gates chose last week to present a controversial new budget that will affect the course of US foreign and military policy for decades to come.
...The Pentagon has been deeply divided over whether the US military should be configured to fight conventional wars against Russia and China, or be transformed into an agile force to combat Third World guerillas.
...Last week, US Defense Secretary Robert Gates finally put an end to this debate. Gate’s newly announced defense budget makes clear that America’s military future lies in what the Pentagon calls, "expeditionary warfare" or "counterinsurgency operations." These, it is clear, will take place mostly in the Muslim world.
The British, less given to euphemisms than Americans, used to call their distant operations against unruly natives, "colonial warfare" or "little wars."
...While Gates was waving his big stick and warning all misbehaving Muslims, President Barack Obama was playing the good cop on his visit to Turkey, offering the "hand of friendship" to the very same Muslim world to which Secretary Gates was planning to dispatch more US troops and Predator killer drones. This sharp irony was completely lost on the US media.
Though the US deficit just reached a staggering US $1 trillion for the first half of 2008, military spending will still rise 4%. The Afghan and Iraq wars will alone cost $200 billion this year.
So much for Obama’s promised government austerity. Plowshares will be beaten into swords. Congressmen and lobbyists will scream to high heaven when some major weapons programs are terminated, but overall, the US military industrial complex is hardly suffering.
.... These realignments of defense spending clearly show the Obama administration intends to pursue a long war strategy in Afghanistan, Iraq, perhaps Somalia, and in other future Third World hot spots located near major oil deposits. President Bush’s so-called "war on terror" cost taxpayers $808 billion. Obama has renamed it "overseas contingency operations," but otherwise he seems to be following Bush’s lead. ...
http://www.lewrockwell.com/margolis/margolis144.ht... -
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aceofspades17 months, 1 week ago
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Strange thing is he said it in Turkey a country who's constitution is probably more secular than ours - Ataturk & now the Turkish military vehemently support strict adherence to secularism.
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Sunday - not Friday is the day of rest in Turkey, Turkish women are forbidden to wear burkas & veils in public - Imagine if Christians were forbidden to wear crosses in public here or religious Jews yarmulkes or Muslim women tradition dress or scarves?
Islam is not the official religion of Turkey - nor is Christianity the official religion of the USA
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Charlson7 months, 1 week ago
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Dionys7 months, 1 week ago
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purplehayes7 months, 1 week ago
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It's irrefutable - not 'ill-refutable' - dumby, or maybe you just don't know how to spell. But I do agree with your point. We are not and never have been a Christian nation in the sense that Iran is an Islamic republic. We are a nation with a large population of Christians, and maybe some of the principles our republic was founded upon are derived from the Western Jeudo-Christian tradition but they are equally traceable to the Age of Enlightenment.
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Furthermnore, the so-called notion of separation of Chruch and State has nothing to do with keeping the State and Religious Faith completly separate (as so many athesits would like to have us believe) the Establishment Clause is simply intended to keep Congress from Establishing any specific Church Denomination as the official National Church, like the Anglican Chruch of England is (or was) in Great Britain.
This is from a practiceing Episcopalian
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Spadecaller7 months, 1 week ago
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Some strange reactions in the air:
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i_27G4rnoRo -
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pokydoke7 months, 1 week ago
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WE have all heard the hue and cry from the religious right that this is a Christian nation founded on Christian principals and that the first amendment guarantees freedom of religion not freedom from religion. I have reminded people on numerous occasions that we are not a Christian nation, we are a nation with many citizens who are Christians. Obama didn't throw anyone under the bus he simply reiterated the truth.
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Endoscopy7 months, 1 week ago
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Let me see if I understand you correctly.
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1. The people coming here mostly came in the beginning for religious freedom. Pilgrims, Puritans, Dutch Reformed, Quakers, etc.
2. This religious tradition continued down to the Revolutionary war.
3. The people at the constitutional convention were with only a very few exceptions Christian.
4. The Federalist papers tell that they considered it a Christian Nation.
5. They stated that if Christianity were to go away the Constitution would fail. It expected the people to use the Christian ethic for it to work.
6. They deliberately kept religion out of the Constitution and inserted the establishment clause because they did not want a single denomination to have any domination over another denomination like was going on in Europe and had happened in the colonial times.
7. The above absolute facts make us a secular nation.
Do I have that correct?
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Spadecaller7 months, 1 week ago
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prophyporcritesComment removed: Spammer, Hard Banned14 Replies
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smithichie7 months, 1 week ago
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If this were a Christian Nation, I would think the ten commandments would be law, instead we have an economy that prospers when at least one of those commandments is ignored, the one about coveting your neighbor's stuff.
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Christians who wish this were a Christian Nation should be careful what they wish for, lest they find themselves the wrong type of Christian with a group they disagree with in charge of what is the 'right' religion. How many Evangelicals would like to be told they have to take part in Catholic ceremonies? Or vice versa? Or to have Mormons getting the tax breaks that Methodists are no longer allowed?
State religions are good for neither states or religions.-
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alakazam7 months, 1 week ago
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"Christians who wish this were a Christian Nation should be careful what they wish for, lest they find themselves the wrong type of Christian with a group they disagree with in charge of what is the 'right' religion."
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I gotta agree with that completely. Take a look at the events surrounding the establishment and revocation of the Edict of Nantes.
http://encarta.msn.com/encyclopedia_761577101/Edic...
Tens of thousands were murdered in the streets because they weren't the "right" type of Christian.
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calitennflo7 months, 1 week ago
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Reminds me of the White House cabal or the NSC...this is their approach to split and devide every group within the US...resulting they gain more power. We must recognize the signs of civil war for what they are...and position ourselves in the middle. Bush did the same thing as Oboma is doing. Truth is we are a politically oriented group of people...a Nation, comrised of human-beings. If the Bill of rights state we shall not abridge a vote on account of race, religion, etc...then Washington shall not make comments so vague.
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The very first amendment states that Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof...(ref:http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitu...
establish-lay down: institute, enact, or establish; "make laws" (ref:wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn)
Amendment XV
Section 1. The right of citizens of the United States to vote shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or by any state on account of race, color, or previous condition of servitude.(ref:http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitu...
Here'sanother amendment that the uS does not follow well...especially the vote of the previously held in federal prisons.-
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Endoscopy7 months, 1 week ago
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ROTFLMAO
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This was an amendment after the Civil war and the servitude referred to slavery. Did you bother to read the date on the amendment? Any State wishing to renter the Union after this date had to ratify this amendment. There were some other amendments in this class.
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antibrainwasher7 months, 1 week ago
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Christians, jews, Muslims, mormans, Buddhists, Hindues, Scientologists, pentacostals........thousands religions all have one thing in common.
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They are all a pile of liquid crap, lies told by kings and con men, selling afterlife to idiots. -
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Spadecaller7 months, 1 week ago
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Church this Way; State that way
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rUWU3MGS2bY -
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Spadecaller7 months, 1 week ago
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Chuck:
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It would be a sad day if all the people in this country felt like you and that they should ridicule others for different beliefs.
I don't care for anyone atheist or religious zealot pushing their dogma on me, but if they are minding their business I sure would not want to be the one to put them down for their beliefs.
Live and Let live.
Tolerance
The Definition of "bigotry" is: " 1. stubborn and complete intolerance of any creed, belief, or opinion that differs from one's own."-
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chuck-the-canuck7 months, 1 week ago
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I understand and can appreciate your kindhearted sentiments, however misguided. But, it is respectful tolerance for the delusional that has got us into this shiit storm.
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Where are you willing to draw the line for respectful tolerance, the caste system in India, the oppression of women by the Taliban, the oppression of gays by the religious right?
Live and let live sounds nice, but that is the rallying cry of the morally bankrupt.
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lloydm657 months, 1 week ago
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Obama doesn't irritate me in the slightest,in fact at seventy five I'm more energised than ever.I know I have to live long enough to see him back home in Hole-in-wall Illinois.With the deposed Gov. gone he might be number one in the hood,or is that the number one hood in Chicago
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Bluedragon9127 months, 1 week ago
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Tolerant, or, for that matter, rational Christians couldn't, however, care less. Someone getting their underwear in a twist over this shows some kind of security issues. Furthermore, if the US was a "Christian" country, that would imply that 95% or higher of people in the population are practicing Christians. Not the case. Or, another way of looking at it would be if the US was, in fact, a "Christian" country, a requirement to be a US citizen would be Christianity as a religion. Therefore, if what Endo said is true (doubtful at best):
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*ahem*
"At present the country is 75% Christian."
So, that means that 25% of the population is...what, exactly?-
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Coatl7 months, 1 week ago
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" if the US was a "Christian" country, that would imply that 95% or higher of people in the population are practicing Christians."
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Almost 95% of Mexicans are practicing catholics, and while some actually say that Mexico is a catholic nation, and was first created as one; it's a secular country where religion is almost seen as some kind of business. Althought I agree that some current laws only make sense if you have a catholic background.
Even when more than 99% of mexicans are actually cristians, it doesn't mean Mexico is not a secular nation.
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Seek_Righteousness7 months, 1 week ago
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Pergamos is where the "Seat of Satan" is, and that is in North-West Turkey, next to the sea. At Pergamos is where Saint Antipas was martyred by Satan worshippers.
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Turkey used to be a land where there were many, many Satan worshippers. Scary.
I hope the United States does become even more of a Christian nation, so that open, blatant Antichrist actions against Christians never is allowed. -
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mesamanp477 months, 1 week ago
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SPADECALLER, you seem to enjoy stirring up the crap but you have little if any constructive alternatives to replace your bloviations. Might I suggest that you go to the state unemployment office and seek a job to occupy your idle time. Just don't get one that requires any skill greater than stacking dishes or cleaning floors. By the way, go the proctologist and get a hair cut before you go.
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Spadecaller7 months, 1 week ago
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mesamanp47,
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You obviously know nothing about me and your ignorance is only surpassed by your vulgarity. What are you 11 years old?
Do you have a comment about the article or are you incapable of an intelligent comment without your juvenile anal references?
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BB647 months, 1 week ago
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Well, I'm a little concerned with the President's comments. They are very typical of your typical liberal college professors found in our public schools. Let's take a look over the last 200+ years and his claims of post Christian nation.
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Christianity in America ended slavery. Your abolitionist movements came mainly out of our Christian churches. I don't remember any mention of the movement getting traction from the Islamic world. In fact many Muslim nations still have slavery, especially in Africa.
Christianity helped to end the threats from Imperial Germany and Nazi Germany. There were no opposition sermons to fighting Germany. At that time, most Lutheran church services were conducted in German. That ended during the wars as a sign of loyalty toward America.
Much of the civil rights movements had their start and continued support of local Christian churches.
During our "Christian" times, we fought & won wars. Built a nation. Established basic human rights & freedoms. Oh and had prosperity. Now under someone who more closely matches a Marxist, Leninist or at best a socialist, we have high unemployment, manufacturing leaving and the highest tax debts in the history of our nation. Who doesn't think we were better off 25 years ago? -
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Spadecaller7 months, 1 week ago
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BB,
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Stop taking those pills, pal.
You must have read one book in your life, The Flat Earther;s Book of History.
You deserve the "Holy Spin" award of the day; and so I dedicate this video to you...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HQMYI65Dkmg-
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BB647 months, 1 week ago
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Since you clearly support the Marxist or Castro policies, please tell me what has socialism gotten the world today? What medical cures have they created? What scientific breakthroughs? What life improving solutions have they brought to the table? Last month you had a former General of the KGB advising President Obama to avoid traveling down the socialist road because it doesn't work. So tell me, where is your socialist paradise actually located?
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