46 Million “Americans” lack Health Insurance - Is It True? »
Posted By WikiMap 4 months, 3 weeks ago in NewsIt appears that the numbers of uninsured in America has been all hype. The 46 million are real but needs to be examined.
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CRYMTYPHON4 months, 2 weeks ago
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I am alway puzzled that what you say, calitennflo.
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It is almost always a short sentence that
makes no grammatical or political sense.
It vaguely references the subject of the post without saying anything
that anyone left or right could agree with.
Are you a real human or some kind of AI?
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ExsnorerComment removed: Hard Banned
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jovial4 months, 3 weeks ago
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I have to sink this one. Here's the link.
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http://www.factcheck.org/askfactcheck/how_many_of_...
"Ever since health coverage became a major issue in the 2008 presidential campaign, we've received periodic questions from readers who wonder whether a large percentage of the uninsured are non-citizens or illegal immigrants. They're not. According to the nonpartisan Kaiser Family Foundation, 79 percent of the uninsured are native or naturalized U.S. citizens. The remaining 21 percent accounts for both legal and illegal immigrants."
The blogger in this story has been infected by Health care industry propaganda.-
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Klarissa4 months, 3 weeks ago
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Endoscopy4 months, 3 weeks ago
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I love it. He was trying to refute the statistics but he really backed them up. I love the 200% of poverty line. That is really stretching it. He brings in kids but then admits the facts about the under 30. He did not really change any statistic in a meaningful way but weasel word around it trying to cast aspersions on it. He changed the figures to leave out the uninsured that qualify for government programs but for some reason never apply. Probably get better care without it. Medicare and Medicaid both ration health care by making payments that do not really pat the health care provider an adequate payment. Therefore they have to find ways to up the money by doing things that are not needed, etc. or else not take them. Medicaid and schools are 60% of the cost to the state governments. It is becoming as black hole for the government and what will happen if everybody is put on this nutty program. Do like Canada and Britain? ration it to the extant that many people die waiting for the necessary care? That is a sad fact about socialized medicine that the liberals never admit to
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EVERY ONE IN THIS COUNTRY HAS HEALTH CARE BUT THE LIBERALS WILL NEVER ADMIT IT. -
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Georgia504 months, 3 weeks ago
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The problem lies not in finding a link to support your position, but in understanding and reading through your own links, ie, the Kaiser Family Foundation report itself.
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Thanks to private and public safety nets available for the uninsured today, here's the difference in what the uninsured pay on average for uncompensated health care each year. In 2008:
$1,686 is what the average uninsured person paid for uncompensated health care
$4,463 is what nonelderly with insurance paid on average for their health care
See page 16 http://kff.org/uninsured/upload/7451-04.pdf
The numbers and statistics that comprise the uninsured is not quite as relevant as the stark reality that regardless of how many uninsured there are, they are better off than the insured thanks to existing health care safety nets. Put another way, there is no health care crisis in the United States.
And we all know this thanks to a link provided by Jovial. -
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mesodude4 months, 2 weeks ago
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I agree, jovial. Cons do nothing more but create museum terrorists and abortion doctor murderers when they try to demonize and pit groups against one another. That one person in the US (whether a legal citizen or not) lacks health insurance is a crime. We have so much here in this great country and so much to be grateful for. This is inexcusable.
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jovial4 months, 3 weeks ago
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"The federal government requires California to provide emergency health care and education to illegal immigrants."
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-Schwarzenegger
This has been going on for years. Prop 187 would have dropped California's obligation to provide illegals services. It was struck down by the federal courts. -
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jovial4 months, 3 weeks ago
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Don't get me wrong, not against clamping down on illegal immigration. If there are millions of illegals in California what do we do with them? Send them to Mexico? Not all of them are from there. There's people of all nationalities here in the U.S. I mean we have illegals here from the U.K. Probably not a lot, but they do exist. How much money would it take to round them all up and deport them? What would be the logistics involved? Where would California find the money to do it? How many law enforcement officers would have to be put on payroll to do the sweep? How many people would be deported by mistake? Where would the detention centers be, how big would they have to be, and how would we feed and clothe them, while they await deportation to their countries of origin? How many would fall through the cracks and not get deported? How many would flee to neighboring states and increase the problems there?
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rondonit4 months, 2 weeks ago
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I personally volunteer to be hired as a $30K yearly Transporter... I'll provide the Cargo Truck to transport them to the border in a manner equal to their ride in. I figure I can carry 40 at a time, 3 trips a week. We'll provide 20 gallon's of fresh drinking water for the 18 hour trip to the border, I'm sure we can find donors to provide snacks like the ones paying airline passengers get as well as paying the fuel expenses. If one man and a truck can return 5% of the incoming, an Army Transportation Batallion could transport the whole mess in less than 6 months (yes, people will die but, not at nearly the rate of the trip north)
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doppich4 months, 3 weeks ago
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Is this the new talking point from the medical cartel and their congressional puppets? That of the 46 million uninsured there are really only 8 million who matter? Gee. That minor problem should be easy to fix. After all, can't all illness can be cured by a taxpayer-funded bonus and another tax cut for the corporate class?
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nostalgia4 months, 3 weeks ago
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The 46 million uninsured is never explained
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U.S. Census Bureau (CPS 2006) reported that there were 10.2 million uninsured "foreign born" individuals who were "not citizens"
According to the same Census report, there are 8.3 million uninsured people who make between $50,000 and $74,999 per year and 8.74 million who make more than $75,000 a year. That’s roughly 17 million people who ought to be able to “afford” health insurance because they make substantially more than the median household income of $46,326. In this group are the 20 and 30 year olds who are employed but declined health insurance through their employer (some employers here will actually increase your salary if you decline the health insurance coverage)
That leaves ~20million without insurance
Who are they?
Congressional Budget Office: 45 percent of the uninsured are going to have insurance within four months
Some of the remaining 20 million qualify for govt programs but have not applied
The Kaiser Family Foundation, a liberal non-profit frequently quoted by the media, puts the number of uninsured Americans who do not qualify for current government programs and make less than $50,000 a year between 13.9 million and 8.2 million. That is a much smaller figure than the media report.
Kaiser’s 8.2 million figure for the chronically uninsured only includes those uninsured for two years or more.
So we are going through this massive overhaul for 8.2 million chronically uninsured?
That doesn't make sense to me-
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mesodude4 months, 2 weeks ago
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"According to the same Census report, there are 8.3 million uninsured people who make between $50,000 and $74,999 per year and 8.74 million who make more than $75,000 a year. That’s roughly 17 million people who ought to be able to “afford” health insurance because they make substantially more than the median household income of $46,326. In this group are the 20 and 30 year olds who are employed but declined health insurance through their employer (some employers here will actually increase your salary if you decline the health insurance coverage)"
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--Wow. I'm stunned. Stunned to find that $50,000 to $75,000 per year is suddenly a king's ransom--when mere months ago cons were trying to scare Americans into voting for McCain because the Obama campaign proposed raising taxes on income over $250,000.
"So we are going through this massive overhaul for 8.2 million chronically uninsured?
That doesn't make sense to me."
--What a surprise... So where do the *underinsured* fit into your equation? Not everyone who "has insurance" has *adequate* insurance. Millions do not.
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jaern4 months, 3 weeks ago
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Sorry Wiki, I have to drop this submission. These statistics are all right out of the mouth of the Insurance Industry who are terrified that we will adopt National Health Care and that will leave them w/o their huge quarterly profits.
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Georgia504 months, 3 weeks ago
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Fine. Along with the deindustrialization of America that has been going on since the 70s, let's add to the job loss those 20 million plus who work in the health insurance industry.
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After all, wouldn't it be better to have 20 million government workers incentivized to bankrupt the nation rather than make their own companies profitable?
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grassyno4 months, 3 weeks ago
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Don't worry, it WILL be 42 million Americans by the time Obama gives all the illegals Amnesty and free (tax payer paid) health care. When Reagan gave them a "one time only" Amnesty, we only had 3 million and Amnesty was supposed to solve the problem. It then jumped to nearly 18 million... and this guy wants to toss in free health care as an added incentive to bring MORE of them in. Bush was bad enough raising the debt to $3 trillion in 8 years. Obama raised it another $6 trillion in just 8 WEEKS... and now he wants to add the most expensive program of all, the one that increases in cost every year. Taxpayer paid health care. He talks great, but his policies defy common sense.
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mesodude4 months, 2 weeks ago
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"When Reagan gave them a "one time only" Amnesty, we only had 3 million and Amnesty was supposed to solve the problem. "
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--So just as destroying a budget surplus earned G.W Bush a second term in office, Reagan's photo is in the living room of every right winger in America because he "only" allowed 3 million to stay and because it was a "one time only" deal? I love how cons think they should be allowed to decide what's "too much" deficit spending, or when we're taxing the wealthy "too much" or when the minimum wage is "high enough". Amazing. ;-P
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cleare4 months, 3 weeks ago
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that's right, blame it all on illegal immigration. (the brown ones, of course, not the white ones) it's all their fault the sky is falling.
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bs!!!
our health care system sucks because health care is a for profit industry in the us. and it cares about profit, not health.
i don't understand anyone who opposes a national single payer plan. unless you are very wealthy and very lucky, everyone knows someone who has suffered needlessly because of lack of access to timely and appropriate health care.
i want doctors who want to heal, not ones who are motivated by greed. i want pharmaceutical companies more focused on researching drugs for diseases that aren't "trendy", not pushing viagra. i want nurses who don't burn out from exhaustion after a few years. i want medical students to be able to afford their education.
i want us all to value each other enough to care that we all stay healthy and productive.-
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sprzats4 months, 2 weeks ago
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Blaming this mess on the illegals is a bunch of crap. I agree with you cleare that health care is for profit. Those that make out on it are the politicians, insurance companies,nursing homes, ($6000.00 a month for a bed) and the pharmaceutical companies. I'm sure that I have left some out but this is for starters.
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The losers are those of us that are paying well more than we can afford and have to deal with these ruthless insurers. I live in a state where having health insurance is a law, To qualify for the state health insurance a person's income has to be so low that most workers don't qualify.
I have to agree that anyone who opposes a national plan is wealthy enough to afford their own medical expenses or are listening to all of the propoganda thrown out by the insuance companies, which end out being the losers (for a change) if we do get national health care.
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starshutch4 months, 2 weeks ago
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I am unemployed and have pre-existing conditions. I had COBRA but it was half of what I was getting in unemployment benefits.
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I couldn't go without coverage, so thankfully the state that I live in has a program in place for people like me and will waive the pre-existing coverage rule. My insurance is still one fourth of my unemployment, not to mention the co-pays.
I cannot get free or almost-free health coverage through the state because I would have to go without coverage for 4 months - which isn't an option. Besides, Minnesota is broke and there are very few jobs here. So it's very easy to lose your coverage, or have to go without if you do not have the money to pay the premiums. When I was in my 20's and healthier, I was without insurance because my employer didn't offer insurance. I was injured in a fall and had to pay the hospital back in installments.
I also have a lot of problems with the insurance companies, who want to dictate what drugs I can take, ect. when the doctor does know best! -
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rondonit4 months, 2 weeks ago
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The Insurance Racket (they gamble that you can't spend more than they charge you for coverage)is totally motivated by the expansive profits they receive by reselling all Medical Treatment and care to you. A single National, Not for Profit plan would not only cover everybodies basic healthcare but, it would also free the Insurance Companies to really write "Insurance". They tricked you into mandating auto coverage (for their profit)now they're trying to trick you into believing that they are the best handler of your health. Look at your Health Policy, of all the Medical Expenses you've incurred, how much was covered and paid by the Insurance Company to the Doctor of your choice? How often were you told you couldn't get a procedure because it was "Out of Network" or otherwise not covered? YOU TOO ARE UNINSURED, you just don't get counted because they're collecting premiums from you.
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moonstream1Comment removed: Spammer, Hard Banned
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moonstream1Comment removed: Spammer, Hard Banned
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moonstream1Comment removed: Spammer, Hard Banned
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fjgalt4 months, 2 weeks ago
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Many of the uninsured aren't needy. They have chosen not to get insurance and spend their money on other priorities.
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Check out these videos
http://www.reason.tv/video/show/560.html
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uKCWbq18bNk-
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bluetexasvalley4 months, 2 weeks ago
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Some people just save up for a rainy day rather than pay premiums to an insurance company.
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Paying the premiums is a gamble; you don't know if they're going to pay for the procedures you need. Putting that money in a savings account at least earns you some interest. ;-) -
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mesodude4 months, 2 weeks ago
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"Many of the uninsured aren't needy. They have chosen not to get insurance and spend their money on other priorities."
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--Cons don't need gas guzzling cars but they buy them anyway and then bitch that we need to destroy the planet looking for more oil so they can continue driving around in their tanks.
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CRYMTYPHON4 months, 2 weeks ago
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"It appears that the numbers of uninsured in America has been all hype. The 46 million are real but needs to be examined.
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I loved the idiot contradiction of that sentence enough to
wade through the familiar swamp of stats in the article.
Those frauds are old friends from years back.
It tells us we don't know how many of the uninsured are
illegal americans, - then removes their millions.
It claims falsely that we count people who currently have no insurance ,
points out that most people without jobs find one within a year,
- and removes more millions.
It tells us that many of the uninsured are young and healthy
and do not need health insurance, - and removes those.
Unimaginately, it keeps 8 million total losers.
By pointing out that these people can always go to the emergency room
it could have removed them too.
Enough.
The movie 'Sicko', was not about those who do not have health insurance;
it was about those who do
- but find that it is worthless.
After job loss, the number one reason for foreclosure is medical expenses.
Your house, - or your life.
We are economicly and spiritualy a poorer nation for the
idiocy of our health dont-care system.
Who defends it?
Those with cheney-care, exempt from the horror.
And anonymous lobbyists like the article's author.
And finaly those who feel their lives would be poorer,
less interesting if everyone had decent health care:
Sadists . -
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fjgalt4 months, 2 weeks ago
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Health care, like any other human value, isn't free. Someone has to provide it. How?
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One can provide for one's own health care, working for it and saving. Then, your care is strictly between you and your doctor.
One can enslave others to pay for it. Not a good idea, especially when the people you enslave (doctors and other healthcare workers) have your life in their hands.
One can force people to pay for it, either outrightly (as Romney did in Massachusetts by making people buy insurance), taxing people through their income and purchases, or being sneaky and hiding the costs in hidden taxes so everything bought costs more.
The problem with the government intervention of the past is that while the productive workers are taxed to pay for health care, third parties decide if and what care they get, with "service fees" for their interference. The government single-payer plan substitutes itself for those third parties. And a government plan usually is a "one size fits all." In effect, you get to pay for health care but bureaucrats get to decide who is worthy of receiving it.-
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Beau78904 months, 2 weeks ago
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"The problem with the government intervention of the past is that...third parties decide if and what care they get, with "service fees" for their interference."
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This is also true for private insurance plans. Middlemen (bureaucrats) working for insurance companies decide if and what care you get, and you pay them for the service. They're not medical professionals, and they get bonuses based on how much they save the insurance company by not paying to your medical providers.
In a government single-payer plan, at least the people deciding on what care you may receive have a goal other than money on which to evaluate your treatment options. -
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mesodude4 months, 2 weeks ago
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"One can enslave others to pay for it. Not a good idea, especially when the people you enslave (doctors and other healthcare workers) have your life in their hands."
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--The thing is, in my experience, it's usually those whose ancestors were slave owners (rather than slaves) who are most likely to use words like "enslave" when it involves taking care of their fellow man's health and well-being. Oddly, we don't hear such descriptors used when we're spending trillions on wars we choose to instigate. Right wingers are quick to remind us that providing for the nation's defense is "in the Constitution" but they sidestep what the Constitution says about providing for the national defense in ways that are reckless, wasteful, deceitful and criminal. I didn't want to pay for wars that the same people who don't care what happens to their fellow man insisted that we needed to fight to "keep us safe" Exactly...How backwards is that thinking--keep us safe from terrorists but say to hell with you when we want health care.
"The problem with the government intervention of the past is that while the productive workers are taxed to pay for health care, third parties decide if and what care they get, with "service fees" for their interference."
--The problem with broad statements about "the government" is that we've seen that the private sector can royally screw things up, too. We'll hear scary stories about "rationing" if the government is involved--but it's the rare person who hasn't been on the losing end of a dispute involving a health insurance claim. So we know rationing occurs in the private sector. Maybe we should avoid talking points that suggest that the private sector will be the holy grail of healthcare. We know otherwise. ;-0
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