Comments for 'Go after ACORN,' judge says - Pittsburgh Tribune-Review »
Posted By k9kssr 6 months ago in NewsA district judge who held another ACORN worker for trial Monday on election law violations urged prosecutors to go after the real culprit, the organization that employed him.
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k9kssr6 months ago
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FTA: "Somebody has to go after ACORN," Senior District Judge Richard H. Zoller said about the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now.
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"It's happening all over the country. All you have to do is turn on the television," he said, referring to voter registration fraud charges brought recently against ACORN and its workers in Nevada.
"We will," Allegheny County Detective Robert F. Keenan promised as he wrapped up his testimony.-
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Beau78906 months ago
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Because he's already blaming ACORN before hearing evidence on individual cases.
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Judges aren't supposed to do that. They're supposed to be impartial. In fact, they're not supposed to say "we need to prosecute" at all--that's the prosecutor's job. Remember?-
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tanglang6 months ago
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What happens if a prosecutor is sleeping at his post? Should a judge not tell him to get to work? And as long as he is not the judge hearing the case he's good right? I mean it's naive at best to think that a judge cannot and does not have an opinion.
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Beau78906 months ago
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You're right--judges can have preconceptions if they're not hearing cases on those matters. But if Judge Zoller is going to speak out publicly about "going after ACORN," then he needs to recuse himself on cases involving ACORN.
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The prosecutors don't answer to judges about what to prosecute. US Attorneys, State's Attorneys and District Attorneys are all either appointed or elected--judges aren't their bosses outside of court. -
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CaptainLucid6 months ago
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You mean crime as in the massive republican effort to send junk mail to minorities and when they don't respond because they don't give a crap once they see the word republican so because of that they no longer live at their registered address so they can't vote anymore? Just wondering.
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mmrhe6 months ago
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ChefEOD6 months ago
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mmrhe6 months ago
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PetesakeComment removed: Hard Banned18 Replies
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ChefEOD6 months ago
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What are you 6? "Bush screwed the country so now its our turn" Is that really all everything is about to you? Your gonna get everything you freeking deserve if that's the case, its just too bad the whole country will get it along with you.
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djn3nunez36 months ago
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"Bush screwed the country so now its our turn" Is that really all everything is about to you?"
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Not what mmrhe posted. "...his party is gonna pay" Let's see they lost the House of Representatives, then they lost the WhiteHouse, and now they are the SuperMinority in the Senate.
And if I do say so myself, with elrushbo as their party spokesman they are going to keep paying in 2010 and 2012. Hahahaha.-
crespiComment removed: Spam
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slate6 months ago
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bubba26 months ago
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slate6 months ago
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bubba26 months ago
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ACORN sponsors voter REGISTRATION drives.
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You can call it "getting out the vote" if you want. And you can 'accuse' them of "just" getting out the voters that would vote Democratic. But, you have NO proof of any of that - just accusation and innuendo.-
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slate6 months ago
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One would assume that a liberal group would have a propensity to go after liberal votes that would further their cause over conservative votes that will diminish their cause. But facts are facts they have registered Disney charaters, dead people and the like.
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slate6 months ago
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So in turn your answer is to show you're willing to jump in Obama's blast furnace to show how smart you are and how ‘different’ you are than the Republicans? I’d not think you doing so proves how much smarter you are, it tends to say just the opposite, especially after the 8 years of whining you did about Bush.
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Besides what does your post have to do with the fact that ACORN has actually rregistered Disney charaters, dead people and the like as Deomcrats? -
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CaptainLucid5 months, 4 weeks ago
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"But facts are facts they have registered Disney charaters, dead people and the like."
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Care to post some evidence or is this just another made up story from the right like the Obama birth certificate BS. If you heard it on right wing news chances are it a complete pile of crap.
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hefaa1Comment removed: Hard Banned
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DaneL6 months ago
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"Although found nowhere in the national archives or known writings of Benjamin Franklin, it is widely accepted that he once said “When the people find they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic.”
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And this is what happened with the last election. -
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tchef6 months ago
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The only problem here is the fact that there were quotas for the number of voter registrations that had to be turned in. This still in no way effected the outcome of the vote. This isn't voter fraud. It's just a violation of the state law. Even if he turned in his own voter registration 3 times, he couldn't vote 3 times. His registrations were more than likely thrown out by the state election board. There's probably a good chance that because of it he couldn't vote at all.
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libsRfunnyComment removed: Hard Banned29 Replies
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bubba26 months ago
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Judge Richard H. Zoller is being very IRRESPONSIBLE.
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He made a blanket statement - "It's happening all over the country" - which is false and disingenuous.
The only current and/or pending indictments against ACORN workers are in Nevada and Pennsylvania.
Not exactly "all over the country" ...
http://www.factcheck.org/askfactcheck/is_acorn_pro... -
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JohnGault6 months ago
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Bubba Turning in voter registration FORMS that turn out to be INVALID is NOT - I repeat - NOT "voter fraud"!!!!
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NO one that filled out those INVALID forms EVER got registered! That means that they did NOT vote anywhere!! Period.
Looking for more but here is one case I found after a quick google search
http://www.dos.state.pa.us/election_reform/lib/ele...
Reality is, do you think the republican party is not going to create their own group to do the same thing? Is this the direction you want things to go? You cannot tell me that some of the false registrations don't go through. Why can't a person vote several times, especially if you do not need an ID to validate your identity?
This HAS to be investigated, the one thing we must all believe in is ONE PERSON, ONE VOTE.-
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bubba26 months ago
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What the cr*p are you talking about???
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I never said that any violation of any election laws should NOT be investigated.
You are still MISSING the point.
ACORN was NOT created by "the Democrats". The people that organized and manage ACORN are people, NOT politicians.
If the Republicans want to "create" a group that promotes voter registration, then can go for it. There is nothing wrong with that.
Yes, I CAN tell you that NONE of those "false" registrations go through.
ACORN is required - BY LAW - to review EVERY collected registration form, and they are required to note or mark every form that is in any way suspicious or possibly invalid. They are required - BY LAW - to turn in EVERY collected form, INCLUDING the ones that may be invalid, to the local election commissions,.
THEN, the local election commissions are the ONLY people that make any official determination as to whether or not those turned-in forms are valid - i.e., whether or not those people can be registered to vote.
BECAUSE the process is so specific, the 'bad' registrations forms are found and thus whoever filled them out is NOT registered to vote, which means that they do NOT get to vote!
That is NOT "voter fraud".
The issues of voter IDs and "how many times" a person votes is NOT the same thing.
Anyone can commit voter fraud even when they ARE registered only ONCE. They do it by using someone else's VALID registration and impersonating those persons.-
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JohnGault6 months ago
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Yes, I CAN tell you that NONE of those "false" registrations go through.
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I JUST PROVED that they DID did you read the article. It can and Has been done just because you don't like the facts doesn't mean its not true. And from the extended reading, the people that are claiming there hasn't been any voter fraud, well yes at looking at the articles date.... the election didn't or hasn't happened yet!
Lets start over,
Do we agree one person, one vote.
That's all I want. Create a system around that. We both want the same thing.-
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bubba26 months ago
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Yes, we agree regarding "one person, one vote".
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NO, the charges per the article are not "voter fraud".
The charges are about voter REGISTRATION fraud. THAT is the fact of the matter.
A person cannot vote if they are not registered.
A person can get registered if they fill out a registration form - validly - and provide supporting documentaiton and/or ID in order to get the registration APPROVED.
Only after a voter registration is APPROVED - and by a local election commission, NOT by ACORN - can that person actually vote.-
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JohnGault6 months ago
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Sorry, to clarify, the article I presented. My concern is not just about ACORN, it is other groups like them, are going to flood the system. Faulty registrations do get through, especially since more and more states are pushing later registration dates.
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It amazes me with all of this technology that we are even having this conversation.-
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mesodude6 months ago
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"Faulty registrations do get through, especially since more and more states are pushing later registration dates."
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--You're only speculating. A more useful approach to addressing potential voter fraud would be to make sure voter rolls were accurate. Then you won't be dealing in paranoid theories when issues arise like inconsistencies between the number of ballots casts and the number or residents in a city. Cons need to stop stalking ACORN and get a life. ;-(
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Endoscopy6 months ago
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Did you bother to read the story. The person was given a quota that he had to fill or he would be fired. That is illegal and ACORN managers did that illegal thing. And this is the organization that Obama wants to handle the census.
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djn3nunez36 months ago
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Obviously the Judge doesn't know what is going on.
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Nevada charges ACORN
Illegal quota system, officials say, spurred 'garbage' registrations
Read all about it.
http://www.lvrj.com/news/44354307.html
On the census
ACORN has indeed signed on to partner with the Census Bureau in connection with the 2010 census, along with about 30,000 other groups at the time of this writing. Others under "A" include, for example, the American Statistical Association, the Asian Pacific American Legal Center, Avon Products Inc. and 57 additional organizations and corporations. The Census Bureau's Web site includes an open invitation to sign on, and the agency says it expects to have more than 100,000 partners by the time the process is over. That may even be an underestimate: In 2000, it signed up 140,000 partners.
And Bachmann is flat wrong about ACORN going door-to-door and gathering data. Being "partners" with the Census Bureau doesn't entail as close a relationship as one might think. For the most part it involves getting the word out that it's important for everyone to participate in the decennial event that helps determine where federal money goes and how House of Representatives district boundaries are redrawn.
But government officials have made it clear that that's a far cry from having ACORN hire workers and conduct the census. At a hearing on April 23 before the Senate Appropriations Subcommittee on Commerce, Justice and Science, Commerce Secretary Gary Locke responded to concerns about ACORN's role voiced by a Republican senator:
Locke, April 23, 2009: [T]he Census will not be hiring anyone from ACORN. We use these so-called partners to get the word out and to spread the word about the need for people to respond and answer the questionnaires. ...We control the hiring. We do not use any government funds to subcontract with any organization to do any activity. ...We are not delegating anything to ACORN.
Fact check this one yourself.
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mesodude6 months ago
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"Reality is, do you think the republican party is not going to create their own group to do the same thing? Is this the direction you want things to go?"
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--You only feel this way because you've made up your mind that what ACORN does is partisan merely because their mission involves registering a segment of our society that just happens to be more likely to vote for Democrats. You seem to be of the opinion that if Republicans "do the same thing" the results would be different for some reason. They wouldn't be nor should they be because poor people aren't likely to start voting for people they know are working to destroy them and suppress their votes. But if you think you could send...I don't know...the Heritage Foundation into the projects to register poor people to vote (lmao), have at it. If you think you could somehow change poor people's political ideology or "get away with" something you believe ACORN is getting away with--go right ahead and see what that gets you. Some friendly advice...it's probably not a good idea to start a group promoting voter registration fraud while Democrats are running the country. You couldn't make anything stick to ACORN when you had that moron Al Gonzales running the Justice Department. Do you really think the Democrats won't be able to sniff out some corrupt cons trying to screw with voter registrations in our inner cities? LOL...Poor cons...You don't even have enough minorities in your party that you could infiltrate the inner cities without being watched like a hawk. Bwhahahahahahaha! ;-P
ACORN registers poor and low income voters--regardless of political affiliation.
They don't discriminate in their hiring either. Because many poor and low income people are minorities, they tend to vote for Democrats. Why do you think you would or should achieve different results among the poor if those
You cannot tell me that some of the false registrations don't go through. Why can't a person vote several times, especially if you do not need an ID to validate your identity?"
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JohnGault6 months ago
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And on a anecdotal evidence, one of my neighbors was discussing going up to NH to vote, he said he didn't have time to drive all the way up there, but his friends were.... to be honest I have no idea if they made it up there, but understanding who my friend is, and his comments to me, tend to believe its true.
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bubba26 months ago
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JohnGault6 months ago
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My friend is registered in my state, somehow they had a way to vote in both. I didn't ask, in fact I was taken a little aback when it happened. His position, is one, that I just didn't expect that from him, and it bothered me, and still does to this day.
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bubba26 months ago
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Ok ... I get it ...
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Your friend may have lived in NH and then moved to your state. He may have registered in your state but never turned in a change-of-address (and residency) in NH. If he didn't file those changes in NH, then he could be registered to vote in both states.
If he did vote in both states, he could get caught. If that happened, at the least they would invalidate one of his votes. Not sure if he would get 'arrested' or 'indicted' - depends on the laws of those states.
Does that make sense? -
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bubba2Comment removed: Spam
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k9kssr6 months ago
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FTA: "Zappala claims the ACORN canvassers engaged in voter registration fraud and a quota system for registrations, which is barred by state law.
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Olga Salvatori, Jordan's attorney, told the judge her client did not know a quota system was illegal. She said Jordan was told he had to bring in a set number of registrations each day or he would be fired."
Sounds to me like ACORN should have known what the law was according to quota registration in the state they were operating. By threatening them with firing, ACORN encouraged canvassers to break state law regarding voter registration. They (ACORN) are either stupid or operate with criminal intent. They should be disbanded on those grounds alone.-
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bubba26 months ago
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I expect that PA can make a decision to prohibit ACORN from operating there, if they see fit to do so based on the final verdict and in accordance with their laws.
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But the state of PA cannot "disband" a national organization. If ACORN is being run badly anywhere or in violation of any laws, that is up to each state or locality to determine such. Only if there are any valid charges that can be applied at the Federal level could ACORN possibly be entirely 'disbanded' (if any such charges warranted that).
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antibrainwasher6 months ago
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paranoia and sour grapes is as repugnicon as lies and bubbling tar.
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Jesus on a jet ski, repugs do love their straw man, they froth and chant and scream, like the terrorists burning the image of US presidents wrapped in the flag.
It's a public display targeted to the base of the party of cons, home schooled evangelical morons, racists, creationists, rethug terrorist cells, and lockstepping trailer trash. -
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cleare6 months ago
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republican rants about a few cases of voter REGISTRATION fraud seems to me to be an effective smokescreen to keep us from addressing the far more serious election frauds we experienced in 2000 and 2004.
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a stupid red herring to divert attention from stolen presidential elections.-
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antibrainwasher5 months, 4 weeks ago
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Exactly right C. When a con is bitching and braying like a mule in heat over some insane trivial non-issue, you can bet the ranch they are doing EXACTLY what they are accusing progressive rational people of doing.
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The fraud is almost always perpetuated by CONS. In the name of making the rich richer, and the powerful more powerful. Massive voter fraud was perpetuated by cons, passing laws disenfranchising minorities, a long long history of jim crow southern white trash racism. That is just solid repug legacy and con reality.
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thesatyr016 months ago
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Democrats. More frothing at the mouth from the party of "tolerance"...as long as you agree with them. Here's a news flash for you lemmings. Over 20 states are investigating ACORN due to voter fraud. There are no charges yet because the cases are under INVESTIGATION.
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As for 2000 the only one who tried to steal the election was Gore. Even newspapers who investigated the 2000 elections said Bush won. As for 2004,only in your imaginations did Bush steal the election.
Must be fun to live in a complete fantasy world like you Libs do. But don't get too comfortable,your political control will be ending soon. One way or another.-
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antibrainwasher5 months, 4 weeks ago
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Lockstepping to the beat of his Mullah, the porcine pedophile Oxy Limpballs. Your paranoid spew reminds one of AM nutjob evangelical creationist tinfoil hat hatemongering Goebbles Beck, as he stirs up the pot of fear to sell to trailer trash.
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CRYMTYPHON5 months, 4 weeks ago
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satyr01: "your political control will be ending soon. One way or another"
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it is 2016.
The democrats have 97 house seats.
The remaining 3 republicans have locked themselves in the bathroom
and are appealing to Greenpeace for protection as an endangered species.
Satyr01 clicks the rifle pieces together.
He ties a red band around his arm, - to mark him as a member of the revolution.
He checks his watch; almost time.
At 12:00 he rushes into the street and is run over by a bus of drunken Democrat party
workers. The lawsuit takes 5 years and eventualy awards him the entire DNC
campaign chest.
With this wealth, - he builds a secret fortress in the last GOP red state: Utah.
He begins a cloning program.
- ok, that is as far as I can get.
I am not saying it can't happen;
I am just saying, imagination won't take me there.
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antibrainwasher5 months, 4 weeks ago
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Jesus, a whole new batch of idiots thinking acorn and voter registration actually means voter fread.
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How stupid can the repugs get? Its like Caribu Barbie cast some stupid spell. If you voted for Caribu Barbie, you're an idiot. Period, end of story. keep that in mind when you try to figure out Acorn.
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primusdog5 months, 4 weeks ago
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Here's how it works, folks. If someone from ACORN registers Micky Mouse to vote, they have committed "voter registration fraud"; there are penalties for that, but the only party harmed by that fraud is ACORN.
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If Micky Mouse shows up and votes, THAT's "voter fraud" and the American public is harmed. There is no evidence of the latter in any of these cases in question.-
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antibrainwasher5 months, 4 weeks ago
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Don't waste your logic on lockstepping cons. They see demons and angles floating around, and base their decisions and values on atavistic urges.
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They shout like they're trained to do by faux noise and Glen Goebbles Beck and Oxycottonballs. They shout acorn and fascist and socialist at Joe the Dumber rallys, and think Caribu Barbie should have the bomb. Its like trying to teach a baboon to type, logic just agravates them. -
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brarsh5 months, 4 weeks ago
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When we come out of a decade of thousands of documented cases of voter fraud with all the accessories - hacked machines, stolen ballots, dishonest software, organized violence - and our institutions saying to ignore and deny it all, pretend it didn't happen and move on, then suddenly get screamingly worked up because of what is really a change in bureaucratic regulations (you can pay people by the hour to collect registrations, but you can't set minimums or pay by the registration),...
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...it's just really hard to take them seriously, or to have much respect for them whatsoever.
If Americans cared about voter fraud, we would be trillions of dollars richer, hugely less a laughingstock and less a monster in the eyes of the world, the environment would be hugely better, our economy would be more functional, and we likely wouldn't need to have little fascist soldiers all over. -
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kobzikov5 months, 4 weeks ago
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Voter registration fraud?
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Sounds serious, but if that kind of thing bothers you y'all should come down to Texas House of Representatives see if you find anything objectionable about ACTUAL voter fraud by Texas legislators.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eG6X-xtVask
Oh and bring Richard H. Zoller along with ya. Let's see if he still thinks that "Somebody has to go after" the culprits when its rich politicians from both parties engaging in actual voter fraud and not employees of organization dedicated to advocating for low- and moderate-income families accused of voter registration fraud. -
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aearthling595 months, 4 weeks ago
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there is a funeral home in New Orleans with an address that was traced to thousands of persons who registered to vote. I believe the voting systems has been corrupted. Time for a national ID card for voting, hospitalization and education freebies.
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