Propeller members....an example of what wrong in America »
Posted By Albmore 4 months ago in Political Opinion
An example of whats wrong
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Albmore
I am a Christian and a Veteran of the first Gulf War. Left the military after 9 years of service. Lived in Europe for several ...
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cowboygrandpa4 months ago
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Albmore:
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Yes I wholeheartedly agree. It matters not which party is in power as long as the people of the United States of America are guaranteed that:
The Constitution and the Bill of Rights are what the laws of the land are based upon.
No party is more important than the Country.
Americans are guaranteed their rights, not illegals who have no rights under the Constitution, because they are not legal citizens or legal immigrants. That means all illegal immigrants from every nation.
That the Freedom of Religion is not the Freedom from religion, but is the freedom to not worship if that is what chosen.
That the Ten Commandments should be displayed in every public school as a way to live, not a religious hammer to beat people into submission.
That those who choose not to live under the Constitution and the Bill of Rights, be told that this is America and it is based upon those ideals.
Freedom can survive, only if it is practiced from the top down and the bottom up. In other words unless all are free none are free.-
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tadair9194 months ago
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RickyDawkins4 months ago
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"That the Ten Commandments should be displayed in every public school as a way to live"
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Hold your Horses Cowboy!
The ten commandments may be meaningful to you, but to others it is to be taken with a grain of salt, equivalent to the tenets of Islam or the belief in pixie dust. I see no reason to believe that the commandments are god's word (or that Gods exist at all).
I'm appalled that a rational person such as yourself would support indoctrinating innocent children with superstitious baloney. -
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kobzikov4 months ago
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You are way, way off cowboygrandpa.
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1. US Constitution is a document that limits what government can do, that is why it specifically outlines what powers government has. This means that under US Constitution illegal immigrants have many of the same rights that American citizens and legal residents have, exceptions being right to vote, right to hold political office, right to hold most federal jobs.
http://www.slate.com/id/1008367/
2. Saying that someone doesn't have any rights under US Constitution implies that you can do anything you want to them, including hold them as slaves. You don't really believe that US Constitution would protect someone from prosecution if they used illegal immigrants as slaves now, do you?
3. The Ten Commandments might have been useful as "a way to live" for Ancient Hebrews for whom they were written according to the Ten Commandments, but to what extent they are applicable today is a matter of extensive debate.
4. Mandating display of Ten Commandments in public schools violates First Amendment, since it promotes doctrines of one particular religion over all others. Moreover, even in Christianity the Ten Commandments vary depending on the denomination, so not only would such a display favor a particular religion, it might also favor a particular denomination, all on taxpayer dime. Furthermore, even if the government mandated the doctrines of all major faiths to be displayed in public schools it would also have to mandate display of main tenets of atheism to not favor religion over non-religion.
5. Until at least 1840s the vast majority if not all schools in US were private.
I think that about covers it. Oh and evolution is not a religion, nor does it teach that there is no God. Many many Christians accept evolution as fact and believe in God. Even Catholic Church recognizes that evolution is a fact.
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theorangetrailblazerComment removed: Hard Banned
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LegalBob4 months ago
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Good assessment. But you also have to realize that anonymous submitters, you know - those with handles rather than real names, would not dare say the same things "across the table" face-to-face to an unknown audience .. as a general rule IMHO of course and from experience as well. It's called "Courage of one's convictions".
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crespi4 months ago
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In Colorado in the 1980's and 1990's I have said what I thought, and told Neoconservatives my mind, and was rewarded with one of them showing me his concealed weapon to silence me, and another Militia/Survivalist threatened my family!
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You CAN'T talk OPENLY face to face with CONSERVATIVES because they are so enraged and violent and if their flimsy argument is being disproved they IMMEDIATELY resort to physical threats.
I tried many times.
NEVER AGAIN.
Just FIGHT THEIR SORRY AS*ES!
By the way, any of you Cons ever threaten my family again you will be very surprised (the LAST thing you will ever be.)
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CRYMTYPHON4 months ago
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Interesting!
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I can comment on your comments there ,
and then discuss the commentary over there, here .
It goes around in a circle,
- exactly like the idea that what is wrong with
America is what is wrong with Propeller:
- people arguing .
Sorry; but you are mistaken.
Propeller is an example of what is right with our
country; that citizens of the same flag talk and yell and
argue with each other.
I could put it more nicely, if you want,
and call it the national discourse or,
'socratic dialogue in the donut shop',
- but nahh, it's argument.
Usualy it isn't very good argument;
but think of mining for gold.
Lots of mud and dirt; little pieces of gold.
So too with argument.
Propeller is a place of strength;
where even the small, mean voices that only tear and rip
have their part in the ecology;
and the slower, deeper words remain, and strengthen our country.
Really; what is right with America, is what is right in Propeller. -
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jovial4 months ago
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An excellent commentary and one that seems to hit home with me on a number of points. Everyone, no matter the political affiliation, wants some sort of change. It's obvious to the American people that there are problems. Ask anyone walking down the street and you will find out what they are. It's jobs, it's healthcare costs, it's the price of real estate and energy, it's education, it's law, it's the circumvention of the constitution, it's gun rights, the list continues on and on. Some American's are one or two issue people, and others are concerned about a lot of issues. I have experienced the blind support for a candidate in this country. It attempted to vilify people who wanted to have their voice heard and were very successful at doing so. It changed our politics in a not good way. There has been dissent about major policy issues from the parties in control. We had dissent on the Vietnam war, the war in Iraq, and so on. Sometimes the dissent was put down forcefully, but with the advent of the internet protests can take shape on the internet. Many political issues owe their beginnings to the internet. When I joined Propeller approx. 3 years ago, the venue here was different. Bush was president, and the "liberals", Democrats, and centrists, who were all labeled "Liberals", were attacked continually about anything they protested about Bush policies. After America's stomache filled of the war in Iraq, a faltering economy, and deteriorating world image. People wanted a change of leadership. Obama campaigned on that issue. He offered hope where before people thought it no longer existed. So people elected him. The venue at Propeller changed. The centrists and liberals had the freedom to push those issues that had been repressed back into the limelight. There's a lot of bitterness there. I don't think it can be extinguished. The Republican party has been laid bare. What's left of it is birthers, neoconservatives, and racists. The sensible lot of conservatives and centrists have been left stranded without a party to identify with. I think that's where people like the submitter of this story came up with the idea of a 4th party. It's not a bad idea. I encourage people to become more involved with politics. Now, how do we do this? How do we make government responsive to the will of the people. That's the big question. 72% of Democrats and independents wanted a public option in healthcare. 50% of Republicans want a public option. How come that doesn't reflect in the Senate votes in the Senate? It's because we aren't just fighting politicians. We are also fighting business interests that are very powerful and have a lot of political clout. So while we are fighting each other over the latest snafu of our elected officials. The status quo silently continues in the background through the efforts of our unseen adversary, business interests. We wind up just spinning our wheels and blaming each other for the continuation of our problems.
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canadianrancher574 months ago
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Exellent comment , its not those in power we have to fear it 's the power behind them that can be dangerous, and really they support both sides.
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They work with the idea that "united we stand , divided we fall", and divide us they do.
When it comes to society ,mosr people regardless whether liberal or conservative are ususally very responsible people in many ways, most liberals do not wish the government to grant them their every wish, and most conservatives realize that there is a place for governmentr in their lives. . It at times bothers me when I see members puting all the blame on others without ever looking at the ideas that they promote, we often talk of the unintended cosequences but that can happen from government not doing enough or also from government doing to much and if politicians were more for the people and not special interests your country and mine might just be better places. -
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usturpin4 months ago
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Very thoughtful and representative of what many feel. I don't identify with the bitter right or the pent up, ready to spend left. I want a blended third party alternative. Do you suppose if the left and the right had a child, it would rise up and rescue us...It is after all, the progeny of a " double negative" which mathematically makes it a positive.....
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usturpin4 months ago
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I suggest forming the demoindepublicans - fiscal restraint, pragmatic internationalism ( big walls with a big gate ), foreign policy that promotes consumer economies to eliminate the fertile breeding ground for authoritarianism - economic improvement can engage the over 50% of the population that is under 20 with no life prospects except toting a gun and controlling a few blocks? Did we not learn anything from ireland ? Lets set term limits for politicians who, like diapers, need to be changed regularly for the same reason ..Both parties are waging class warfre by conjuring the Marxist belief that the way you unify people is through a common experience, a common religion or a common enemy. America needs to wake up and improve its political IQ and not feed on the cotton candy fundamentalism of far right and far left pundits.
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Can we learn to think for ourselves and when we do, will we have the guts to throw the wind socks in Congress out on their ear ? -
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fjgalt4 months ago
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Rarely, when there are conflicts such as religious teaching in school, does one question whether there should be compulsory schooling or that the government should be forcing children to learn the current philosophy of the gang in charge.
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There should be no compulsory schooling. Parents should be free to shop in the free market of ideas for those schools that teach the principles that the parents want their children to learn.
It is only in a country based on Liberty that there are no conflicts such as have been described in this discussion.
One of the primary motivations for establishing government-run schools in the U.S. was for the incoming immigrants (mostly Catholic Irish and Italian) to learn Protestant values. -
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coolrayfruge4 months ago
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Propeller is a good forum for people to voice their opinions on things like politics,the economy.
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It lets you look at things from different views that people have.
Weather you like their views or not.
It is only a threat to those who would like to suppress and discourage such forms.
Cause thats usually how revolutions are started.
The coming together of the people.
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