NY Times Manipulates Poll, Claims Health Care Reform Opposition "Growing" »
Posted By jovial 4 months ago in Political Opinion
There's a little concern that the quality might diminish if the government passes reform (69 percent), but there is almost an identical number (66 percent) of respondents who feel they will "lose" their health care altogether if the government fails to act!! Haha!
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jovial
Grew up In Brooklyn. Joined the Navy in 1976 stayed in 10 years. Aircraft Electronics tech. Worked for Major Govt. contractor then settled in California ...
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jovial4 months ago
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The N.Y. Times, constantly accused of being a liberal rag is being influenced by money to distort the truth to support the views of Republicans and the insurance lobbying groups. It has been busted lately again and again for misrepresenting the news in a fair way. Just the other day they had a front page news story about a colonel that said we need to pull out of Iraq because we overstayed our welcome. Later on in was proved that the story came form a blogger that is fundamentally anti-healthcare reform. Since when have bloggers gotten their stories shuffled to the front page? In that story Colonel Reese said this,“As the old saying goes, ‘Guests, like fish, begin to smell after three days,’ ” Colonel Reese wrote. “Since the signing of the 2009 Security Agreement, we are guests in Iraq, and after six years in Iraq, we now smell bad to the Iraqi nose.”
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rbiii4 months ago
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Did you two read the actual NYT's article?
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It is pretty straight forward and the poll does indicate there's growing unease in what is eventually going to come out of Congress.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/30/us/politics/30po...
The NYT story is a news article and not an OPED, btw. -
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Spadecaller4 months ago
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The N.Y. Times has not been a liberal rag for several years. That is not theory. One just needs to study the investors and shares of ownership to see the truth. As usual, when you follow the money you will inevitably discover who's behind what. The N.Y. Times is supporting those who want to obstruct the adoption of new health care reform -- especially the public option.
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The truth is that our last vestige of a fee press lies right before us -- on the Internet.
Most of those who still like to label the N.T. Times as a liberal paper are so far to the right that centrist conservatives look more like flaming liberals to them. -
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CHAM4 months ago
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There is so much false information out there that the public has no idea what the truth is. This much I do know: The Insurance companies don't necessarily tell a policyholder what procedures they can have, but they are quick to tell us what procedures they won't pay for however. That is what they call managed care.
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And that is what the anti reform crowd calls socialism ( if the Government does it ). The insurance Companies don't want a Public Option because they know within a short time of a Public Option being available they can see the "Going out of Business" door opening up for their companies.
And people will be leaving them because the people will realize that the Public Option is best. No one will have to force them to take that option, and the Insurance Companies know this.
That's why the Insurers are spending a Million a day to mislead the public into thinking that they are trying to help the public. They are selling fear to keep their cash cow going.-
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mesodude4 months ago
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"There is so much false information out there that the public has no idea what the truth is. This much I do know: The Insurance companies don't necessarily tell a policyholder what procedures they can have, but they are quick to tell us what procedures they won't pay for however. That is what they call managed care."
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--The thing is, I'm never sure with those on the right if it's an issue of disordered thinking (such that they can convince themselves "managed care" is anything other than a fancy term for rationing) or if it's just that their whole life's philosophy is "my agenda, my way, by any means necessary, at any cost." Until Bush was elected, I'd never dreamt there were so many moral relativist so-called Christians in our country. I'm not a very religious person at all but my conscience would never allow me to horde, lie, cheat, steal, covet, and kill to achieve my agenda based on my perception that the other guy is getting away with or has gotten away with something in the past. I can't imagine what kind of deity these people think would embrace their poisoned souls. ;-(
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mesodude4 months ago
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The characterization of these results isn't as bad as some others I've seen but I share the writer's obvious sense of frustration. Thursday, TimA posted Time Magazine's analysis of its recent health care reform poll (entitled "Americans Back Obama's Reform But Worry About Details"), and I looked over the actual poll questions and scratched my head trying to understand how the writer was able to assess "worry" from the results. What I found with both this poll and the NYT poll, sometimes words and phrases like "worried about" (as in, "I'm worried that healthcare costs will rise") and "believe that" (as in I expect that health care costs will rise) are used interchangeably. Thinking that you *could* lose your job is different from "worrying" that you will lose your job (a mindset which, in my view, shouldn't be presumed to be a given). Asking people if they think something will happen does not necessarily mean they are "worried" it will happen.
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mesodude4 months ago
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Ooops...I forgot this story was actually about the NYT poll. I linked the actual poll questions below. Some observations:
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A) Not including about a dozen demographics related questions, this poll is 97 freaking questions long! LOL I'm sorry but whether responses reflected negatively or positively on Obama, these people were being tortured. Pure and simple. By about question 17, I imagine most people would have answered anything to get off the phone. OMFG. ;-x
B)I don't believe it's fair to "lead the witness" with questions like "How *concerned* are you that..." this or that will or won't happen? You could just as easily ask the question "How *confident* are you that..." this or that will or won't happen? IOW, ask how people feel about the possiblity of something happening and then give them multiple choices. Don't *suggest* in the question that they are "concerned* about anything.
C) Among the more interesting responses: 75% of those with insurance said it was affordable. That seemed high until I learned that 62% of respondents were either childless or empty nesters.
http://documents.nytimes.com/new-york-times-cbs-ne...-
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CHAM4 months ago
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Meso you certainly gave some valuable information - thanks. And you are so right about poll taking. The results can be so skewed by the questions or the poll sample population and how the samples are chosen.
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With my wife's situation, our medical costs are extensive but we are able to handle it because I have a good income even though I am in my 70's. The great majority of Senior Citizens are not so fortunate however.
I am aware of so many who have to make a choice between Insurance or Medicine or food and shelter. And at an advanced age, these people become to have to depend on the mercy of others, because if there is much money involved, you are not going to get it out of the Insurance Company is there is some way they can get out of it.
So if a pollster asked me if I can afford my Health care costs and I answered yes, the next question they should ask me is my Financial Health.
And their results should be grouped to income levels and age.
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lloydm654 months ago
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This is a wonderful event,the ultra left wing of the give me crowd attacking the New York Times.The health Care fiasco has been adopted,not all,but some.I'm afraid the part you were looking for,well it didn't make it.Sorry.I think allowing people to move into medicare before their retirement date is a slap in the to the present retirees.I knew a man who at fifty who needed medical treatment,and check on medicare he was told that to pre-enroll in medicare at sixty two would cost seven hundred dollars a month.Are we going to ask working people to buy that.
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CHAM4 months ago
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LLoyd. Working people under 65 can't buy into Medicare unless there is some qualifying reason. I have Medicare and the Premiums are about $110 for me and $110 for my wife.
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We each pay Close to $200 per month for Medipak and we each pay around $70 per month for Prescription coverage.. That comes to about $760 per month for my wife and me. In addition to that we have co-pays and then there's the doughnut hole for prescriptions. And of course there's the things not covered. We spend about $20,000 per year on Health Care.
Most retired people can't afford that cost. So they go without.
The thing is if the average family pays about $10,000 per year ( including working families ) then with about 77 million families paying in that amount to a Government plan the money then available to pay for the Government plan would be 77million time $10,000 =770 Billion.
Those people wouldn't be paying anything to an Insurance Company. It would be cheaper for me to pay that, but not for everyone.
The biggest losers in a Government plan would be the Insurance Companies.
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