This story was previously titled "President Obama Presses Pentagon for More Information Before Making Decision On Afghanistan"
President Obama Presses Pentagon for More Information Before Making Decision On Afghanistan »
Posted By Newperson 1 week, 3 days ago in Political NewsSome White House officials thought that President Obama's 8th "war council" meeting Wednesday to decide on a strategy for Afghanistan and Pakistan might be the last. But by the time it wrapped up, no decisions had been made and so many lingering questions remained about the strategy forward, it seemed clear that more meetings were necessary and any announcement will be delayed far beyond the unofficial November 11 deadline administration aides had been shooting for. In Wednesday's meeting, Pentagon officials presented more details about four strategies -- two from Gen. Stanley McChrystal, and two others -- but President Obama was not satisfied with their assessments. Specicially, he pushed the generals to clarify how and when U.S. troops would be able to turn over responsibility to the Afghan government. The key sticking points appear to be timelines and mounting questions about the credibility of the Afghan government," an administration official said, adding that the President "wants to make it clear that the U.S. commitment in Afghanistan is not open-ended. After years of substantial investments by the American people, governance in Afghanistan must improve in a reasonable period of time to ensure a successful transition to our Afghan partner.Currently 68,000 US troops are in Afghanistan. All four of the options the president and his war council are discussing add more troops, but with different troop levels, costs and strategies. The most ambitious strategy, from Gen. McChrystal, would send 40,000 more troops.
But White House officials disagreed, saying a decision was still weeks away.
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Newperson1 week, 3 days ago
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Endoscopy1 week, 3 days ago
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He picked the most knowledgeable General about this kind of war and sent him there. He received his report after he had been there for months. Since then he has been talking politicians about this. Who in the Pentagon is more expert on this than Lt. Gen. Stanley McChrystal???? He is the acknowledged expert on this kind of war and has been on site for months.
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Obama is being stupid. My wifes sister did similar things. She went around to several people until she got the answer she wanted and then would say that that person said she could. The problem is as the sign on Trumans desk said, "The buck stops here". What ever he decides is his responsibility. -
hyperbolaComment removed: Spam
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hyperbola1 week, 3 days ago
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Yep. Above all he needs to resist the "israel-first" traitors that now pervade the Pentagon. A "general" like McChrystal that owes his appointment to "israel-firsters" and runs off to them to write "his" report to the President has no business commanding American troops.
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Equally importantly, we do NOT need to have our democracy ended by military cabals.
America Owned by Its Army
http://www.propeller.com/story/2009/11/08/america-...
It is possible that the creation of an all-professional American army was the most dangerous decision ever taken by Congress. The nation now confronts a political crisis in which the issue has become an undeclared contest between Pentagon power and that of a newly elected president.
Barack Obama has yet to declare his decision on the war in Afghanistan, and there is every reason to think that he will follow military opinion. Yet he is under immense pressure from his Republican opponents to, in effect, renounce his presidential power, and step aside from the fundamental strategic decisions of the nation. ....
....The Vietnam war was opposed by the public by the 1970s, when according to the Pentagon Papers, the government itself knew that victory was unlikely. Today the public doubts victory in the war in Afghanistan. However the version of Vietnam history most Americans (who were not there!) read today says there really was no defeat at all.
It is argued that there was only a collapse of civilian support for the war, caused by the liberal press, producing popular disaffection both at home and inside the conscript army, with a breakdown of military discipline, “fraggings” (murders) of aggressive combat leaders, and demoralization in the ranks. This is the version most military officers believe today.
It is an American version of the “stab in the back” myth believed in German military and right-wing political circles after the first world war. ....
...After Vietnam, Congress ended conscription (which in that war had become heavily corrupt: the poor and working classes were drafted, while many of the privileged had influential families and found complacent doctors or college deans willing to hand over unjustified draft exemptions to those -- like the future Vice President Richard Cheney -- who had “other priorities” than patriotism and national service. -
hyperbolaComment removed: Spam
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fsev411 week, 2 days ago
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ekklesiawarriorblock13 hours, 31 minutes ago
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"If a conservative reads this, they'll prop it and share it with their friends so they can all have a good laugh". This has beeen well written, good stuff.
We will add another line -
A conservative in thinking process weighs all angles and options with cool logic. ....."
Thus one would have to argue that Obama is actually a conservative.
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mesodude1 week, 3 days ago
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Not surprisingly, some of the same people who want us to s-l-o-w down on health care reform (apparently until several hundred legislators agree on legislation which is flawless) want Obama to hurry up (and let them know how much longer they'll be able to profit from war.
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voodkokk1 week, 3 days ago
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Has anyone ever thought that this war council is incapable of making a decision. It is mind boggling to understand why Americans think that just because someone is elected that they are qualified. What war experience does Obama have? What experience does he have at all? It couldn't even bring in the olympics to Chicago, so how is he qualifed to make a decision on Afghanistan?
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fiftynine1 week, 3 days ago
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" What war experience does Obama have? What experience does he have at all?"...
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Apply that same statement to bushboy...He is the one responsible for this mess...
That pos lied to you,me and the rest of the country to get into Iraq and you lock stepping fugs bought right into it...Now what war experience did bushboy have...ZERO..and his incompetent handling of every thing will haunt us for a long time. -
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hyperbola1 week, 3 days ago
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Well, you are perhaps correct that the decision should be easy. The only real resistance to ending Afghanistan comes from right-wing extremists (many of them israel-firsters whose primary loyalty is not to America).
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'Rethink Afghanistan' Destroys Failed Logic of War
Must Watch: Robert Greenwald's new video documentary.
Americans should stop and rethink support for a war that worsens by the day, costs billions of dollars, causes the deaths of U.S. soldiers and countless Afghan civilians and which, ultimately, will make the U.S. less safe.
http://www.propeller.com/story/2009/10/07/39rethin... -
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mesodude1 week, 3 days ago
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"Has anyone ever thought that this war council is incapable of making a decision. It is mind boggling to understand why Americans think that just because someone is elected that they are qualified. What war experience does Obama have?"
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--Name someone you've supported who did a better job and explain why. Exactly...*crickets* Cons love to shoot off their mouths and make claims that Obama is inexperienced in this area or that area but they choke when it comes time to explain how Bush was better. Actually, that's not true. Sometimes they lie or turn logic entirely upside-down. Case in point...Obama is ridiculed for relying on a teleprompter in some speaking engagements but Bush (who only stopped using a teleprompter because his handlers realized he was even less coherent using one than without) was praised for talking like the "common man." Exactly...More con HORSECRAP.
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voodkokk1 week, 3 days ago
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Obama is just another politician elected to the white house from a bunch of disgruntled teenagers and left wing radicals that thought he was going to give them what they wanted. He has pulled the wool over so many and people still can't figure out why he can't make a decision. Maybe someone should put the decision on a teleprompter so he cn read it. Worst president in history.
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hyperbola1 week, 3 days ago
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Digging America out of the deep hole dug for us by Bush and his ZionCons is a monumental task. The sooner we get out of Afghanistan the better.
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Hollow Victory - GOP Wants to Kill Lots more Americans in Afghanistan
According to the Republicans, the United States is once again at the crossroads of losing another critical war because of feckless Democrats. Only this time it's Afghanistan.
The real tragedy of Vietnam is not that the United States lost, but that it became involved in the first place. It pains me to say this as someone who served in the American military from 1965 to 1975, but the anti-war movement was right: It did not matter to U.S. security whether North Vietnam conquered the south and unified that country under communist rule. More than 58,000 American soldiers and more than 2 million Vietnamese died in an unnecessary and foolish war.
A similar logic applies today with regard to Afghanistan. .... In Afghanistan, as in Vietnam, it simply does not matter whether the United States wins or loses. It makes no sense for the Obama administration to expend more blood and treasure to vanquish the Taliban. The United States should accept defeat and immediately begin to withdraw its forces from Afghanistan.
Of course, President Obama will never do such a thing. Instead, he will increase the American commitment to Afghanistan, just as Lyndon Johnson did in Vietnam in 1965. The driving force in both cases is domestic politics. Johnson felt that he had to escalate the fight in Vietnam because otherwise the Republicans would lambaste him for "losing Vietnam," the same way they accused President Harry Truman of "losing China" in the late 1940s.
Obama and his fellow Democrats know full well that if the United States walks away from Afghanistan now, the Republicans will accuse them of capitulating to terrorism and undermining our security. And this charge will be leveled at them for decades to come, harming Democrats at the polls come election time. The Democrats have no intention of letting that happen.
The United States is in Afghanistan for the long haul. As was the case in Vietnam, more American soldiers and many more civilians are going to die in Afghanistan. And for no good reason.
(John Mearsheimer, a West Point graduate, is a political science professor at the University of Chicago.)
http://www.propeller.com/story/2009/11/07/hollow-v... -
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Tangent0011 week, 3 days ago
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"Worst president in history."
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So the guy who was handed a shlt storm, both internationally and domestically, by his predecessor(s) has to fix every little thing in 10 months?
I wonder if you held Bush to the same standard, since he and the Republican-held Congress didn't do jack squat for 8 years.
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urme1 week, 3 days ago
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Anyone with half a brain now fully understands that the American public was lied into war by our ruling elite and the corporately controlled media. We have also watched our soldiers routinely maimed and killed in a quagmire that neither this administration or the last can explain. Why are we there? What do we hope to achieve? When will we know it is time to bring our troops home?
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We were led to believe we were liberators. Remember Cheney ? We have fragmented the world with the corporate lies of 9-11.
Please Obama, think long and hard, the future of humanity is in your hands. -
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cowboygrandpa1 week, 2 days ago
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I'll just say that Bush was less than wise in his decisions.
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His inappropiate reactions to what was an act of terrorism, has grown to a continuing act of terrorism by all parties involved.
Our soldiers are being terrorized by a government that refuses to see the insanity of sending people on numerous tours of duty.
The inhabitants of the countries are being terrorized by the insanity of all the factions fighting in the war.
They cannot turn to any without becoming an enemy of another.
Yep Mr. President, I'm glad I don't have your job !!!!!
I would not be able to sleep at night knowing that so many lives depended upon the correct decisons being made.
Don't be a bumbler like Bush.
Look at all the information, and base your decisions upon what is best for all. -
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gamahuche1 week, 2 days ago
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Afghanistan has never been tamed in its entire history - and the list of those who have tried is goes back to the 6th Century.
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The latest effort by the Russians defeated a regime that didn't have to worry about the body-bags coming home - and helped to precipitate the collapse of significant parts of the Soviet Empire.
Aside from that, since the US's ONLY actual interests in Afghanistan - since all efforts to catch OBL in his cave ceased long ago - is its strategic location in terms of gas and oil pipelines the only reality to explore is whether there is even a glimmer of a hope of protecting hundreds of miles of pipeline for decades through what will always be hostile territory.
As for Obama's current predicament - he's clearly between a rock and a hard place.
Supporting the discredited Karzai would be as foolish and dishonourable as supporting Saddam Hussein. Trying to replace him with somebody - WHO??? - is also a non-starter.
Simply bringing the US troops home will also not sell well at home.
Finally isn't it interesting that those who are trying to goad Obama into risky and dangerous action are those who are wetting their pants in anticipation of his failure. -
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Daylight1 week, 2 days ago
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May be Obama couldn't find mercenaries like Blackwater amounting to 40.000 of such a large numbers to send to Afghanistan. So he might want to fight the war by proxy and puppets and that's only way Democracy can be imposed on those who reject democracy.
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I think that Obam would like to kill more innocent people and escalate violence in other countries in the name of Democracy to show the world America is for freedom and justice and those are fighting the America are some kind of fundamentalists or extremists radicals. But the problem he faces is that when his forces are being killed in large numbers on a daily basis, it brings down his popularity at home.In fact he will beat Bush if he has given a chance to kill the people who stand in the way of the US interest such as oil and gas.
In my opinion media is looking to find some bad news everyday about Islam for American people to be brainwashed to believe that the Muslims are going to turn America into an Islamic theocracy and are a threat to their country. So this can help the Right Wing radicals and the Zionists to get whatever they want for a short time but in the long run they will render America a bankrupt country. -
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Ukrainian1 week, 2 days ago
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Obama has to move as quickly as possible to avoid catastrophe and pass the stimulus, and rush to pass Obamacare because the anti-Obamacarists are happy to see sick people dying in the streets. However, no hurry on Afghanistan, where the Taliban is actually shooting at our people. Got to take time to get that one right. Its so expensive.
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Oh, he is so cool and cerebal. Folks, snap out of your delirium already. -
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